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the_Monk
the_Monk
Join Date 01/2008
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Game-setup "options" should be used for balance...

...enough of "nerfing" this and "nerfing" that!

March 17, 2008 4:50:46 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

 

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the_Monk
innociv
Join Date 02/2008
+34
Reply #1 March 17, 2008 5:28:23 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
How does the game balance differ when all options are on high/medium/slow?

The fleet one has the most major impact. The others just make the game go quicker/slower, they don't make one unit better or worse compared to the other.
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the_Monk
the_Monk
Join Date 01/2008
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Reply #2 March 17, 2008 5:35:15 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I think the speed at which things research, build, move, etc. absolutely impact which units/strategies (by extension race) might perform better or worse on any given map/scenario.
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the_Monk
Sakhari
Join Date 03/2006
+6
Reply #3 March 17, 2008 5:45:40 PM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums
While I have no argument against there being more options, I think it's generally assumed that 'normal' settings in each of the offered options are the standard that the game is being balanced around. If a game is going to support any sort of competitive multiplayer, there does need to be some kind of standard.

And if it's not in the 'vision' for this game to support that kind of play, that's fine too but someone should probably say so to keep from stringing people who want that sort of thing along.
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the_Monk
innociv
Join Date 02/2008
+34
Reply #4 March 17, 2008 8:11:54 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I think the speed at which things research, build, move, etc. absolutely impact which units/strategies (by extension race) might perform better or worse on any given map/scenario.


When you have research, gamespeed, ship speed all on high it doesn't change how the game plays any, just maeks it faster.

There is only somewhat imbalancing if you say have fast ship speed, build speed, fast resources, but slow research.
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the_Monk
the_Monk
Join Date 01/2008
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Reply #5 March 17, 2008 8:21:21 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

That's exactly what I was suggesting. Having one on high, one medium, one slow. I think that would skew anyone's "balance".

That's my point, it's the game-options that allow us to shift the "balance". Whether we are long or short-game gamers, the game-options (more than anything else) are what is balancing or un-balancing (depending on who you ask) the game.


the Monk
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the_Monk
Technolopithicus
Join Date 09/2006
0
Reply #6 March 17, 2008 8:24:35 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Well, I think what he's referring to is the "tug-of-war" phenomenon. You know, when one massive spacebattle persists for the last half of the game because both sides keep sending a massive line of reinforcements. In this instance, setting resources to low and ship speed to fast would remedy this issues quickly (and probably end the game a lot sooner).
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the_Monk
innociv
Join Date 02/2008
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Reply #7 March 17, 2008 11:49:08 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
That's exactly what I was suggesting. Having one on high, one medium, one slow. I think that would skew anyone's "balance".That's my point, it's the game-options that allow us to shift the "balance". Whether we are long or short-game gamers, the game-options (more than anything else) are what is balancing or un-balancing (depending on who you ask) the game.the Monk


Yeah well.. this is rather ilrelevant.

Most people run all high, or all medium.
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the_Monk
the_Monk
Join Date 01/2008
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Reply #8 March 18, 2008 1:29:03 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yeah well.. this is rather ilrelevant.

Most people run all high, or all medium.




Well as Sakhari already pointed out, for balancing purposes there needs to be a "standard". If as you say most people are playing on either "medium" or "high" and for argument's sake the game is being balanced for normal (which is where I personally think it should be balanced) then it's no wonder certain things feel off at other settings.

That being said, that shouldn't result in mass forum-flaming about "balance". Adjust your game-settings (I'm sure the devs will keep giving us more and more) and move on.   


the Monk
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the_Monk
Blair Fraser
Join Date 10/2006
+292
Reply #9 March 18, 2008 3:52:03 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yeah well.. this is rather ilrelevant.Most people run all high, or all medium.

If you are curious: our online stats say 99% of people leave everything on normal (which surprised me since I expected most online games to use fast). I don't have hard numbers, but anecdotally it would appear to be the same for singleplayer.

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the_Monk
SquidLord
Join Date 04/2003
+7
Reply #10 March 18, 2008 4:21:17 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yeah well.. this is rather ilrelevant.Most people run all high, or all medium. If you are curious: our online stats say 99% of people leave everything on normal (which surprised me since I expected most online games to use fast). I don’t have hard numbers, but anecdotally it would appear to be the same for singleplayer.
Blair, I know I only speak for myself (and thousands of fans and mindless slaves), but I’d be really pleased if Sins had an opt-in method to gather data from single-player and private network games to help add to the pool for ballancing and bug-hunting.

Personally, we generally play on Normal because we’re looking to have fun and poking at several dozen planets across a large area is hard enough without the reflexes of a 12 year old mainlining Ritalin, the kind of guys we have to deal with in Call of Duty 4 on a regular basis.


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the_Monk
Redion
Join Date 11/2007
0
Reply #11 March 18, 2008 4:23:07 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
In my opinion, balance issues have been and are more likely to continue to be addressed via the "game setup options" rather than unit values or the black market. I believe that the developers will continue to look at more in-depth "game setup options" for game-balance and this is certainly a good thing. What if there was a game setup option to lock-out victory for the first hour? Enabling those who wish for a slow game to actually be able to set it via the server and be guaranteed no one would "rush" their homeworld for at least an hour. Game-balancing/changing setup options are virtually endless. My point is, that is where I believe the devs will focus.

More game-setup options is never a bad thing.

We have an option to disable the pirates, why not an option to disable the market? Might make for some interesting game-play?


Hi Monk, Just to tell. . I completely agree in your view!!

Redion
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the_Monk
Astax
Join Date 04/2003
+24
Reply #12 March 18, 2008 4:31:27 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Most of the games I play are all Fast (except fleet size which we keep normal, and culture which can vary normal or fast). Those seem to be the least offensive settings. yes I see plenty of all Normal games, usually ran by new players. I join them sometimes. It does throw me off a bit being used to all fast.

Overall yes having greatly variant speeds will have effects on balance, but we are usually going y same settings. If anything stuff on all fast except research will show the early TEC dominance to be even more pronounced.
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the_Monk
FlashXAron
Join Date 03/2003
+1
Reply #13 March 18, 2008 4:48:33 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Yes I also ... please make a LOT MORE Gameoptions and best one:

"USER DEFINED xxx"

(xxx is a number)
where you could change the values with an inbuild TEXTEDITOR and the files are in a seperat Directory - not a mod) If the core game finds a value there it overwrites the one used in the settings.

Say you put everything at "SLOW" and than you activate, "user defined 001" it looks there and overwrites the settings ... so you could alway have the latest Patched settings combined with yours , and not like now that someone always have to edit ALL files, when there is a new patch out ... in the "user defined xxx" are only the values I really want to change.

It even would be cool, if you open the "USER DEFINED XXX" you see ALL VARIABLES and could change them direct there. (Even maybe with a short description what this value is used for and what value was the original) but ONLY the ones I changed are saved. So if a new Version (patch) comes out, I don't have to edit once again all files.

PS: Please DEVS could you change "sec" into "day" would feel better, when there is needed time to develop a destroyer "120 days" and not "120 sec"

Also please, show the values with 3 digits in the GUI like, 0.000 because when you use slow down mods and rare resources, the value you gain is most of the time below, 0.00 ...
THX

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