Medicare's broke & going broker.  Medicaid's broke & going broker.  The VA's broke & going broker.  There's 3 reasons.

And I won't sell my health and well-being for false security.  This is the nubbin of the current healthcare debate.  It really does come down to self-determination and free will vs. the false security of the nanny-state.  Once it is completely in charge of healthcare, there will be no recourse, the decisions of the state (the de facto 'death panel') will be final.  They have no intention, of course, of 'pulling the plug' on you - they just intend to put an 'expert panel' protected lock on all the outlets.

You mean like 'patriot,' 'freedom,' and 'free markets' are swear words to the left?

1. So, your fear and driving motive against the health care reform is that a government run health care system will run out of money and in the end ruin the country (even more)?
2. Do you acknowledge that public health care in other countries works or do you think we are hallucinating?
3. Drugs in the USA are tremendously overprized. Famous example: Asthma inhalers apparently cost up to 120$ in USA and 0,05$ in Cuba. Pharma coorporations succeeded in outlawing drug imports from countries like Canada to protect their profits. Shouldn't free market rules apply?
   

Probably. Explains why it's so hard to debate honestly when half the words are ideologically charged.

How would the United States be able to afford public health care? We're already hundreds of billions of dollars in dept, and of course raising taxes on the rich probably won't be enough. Also considering our enormous obesity rate, I'm just not sure if public health care would be sustainable at the moment.

Though of course, this is from someone not entirely educated on the subject... >__<

hm, can someone actually explain just why medicaid and medicare is so broke? I'd suspect it has something to do with them only treating rather sick and poor, thus expensive ppl. in that case, no wonder it is costly and running a deficit. if it is just badly run, then I see part of the problem: no one wants power to a system that has proven its inefficiency. but then ... would you not want to work on that? would you not demand from the government to make it more efficient. then, maybe, more people would be ready to accept government control.

also, I saw the list at the post is constantly updated: on the pro side you can write 'private companies are not only inefficient with their funds, but also greedy'. for the funds they consume, I don't thing services are as comprehensive as elsewhere. I'd bet there are some treatments, necessary ones that fall under the expensive category, that are not covered much, if at all and  that is less performance for more cost, thus lower efficiency.

@ aroddo: hm, yes, that was about what I expected. the private insurers to pick only those that have few conditions and thus cost little whereas the public ones get a disproportionate amount of costlier people. which would not be that bad if those costs were distributed over a wider basis or could be compensated by more 'cost-effective' customers. actually, there is a phenomenon like that in economics literature: adverse selection. you can look it up if you want, quite interesting stuff. can even outright destroy a market altogether.

The liberal's lament: If we only had more of other people's money and more rules and regulations, we could fix these problems.

Simply look at history - there's never been enough OPM and never been enough rules.

There is a reason the US is different from eurocentric socialist countries - we have different values and beliefs.  I don't consider the 'charge' that the US spends the most per capita on healthcare an insult or a defect.  There is no such thing as a 'right' amount of GDP which should be 'consumed' by healthcare, as if it is money we simply pour down some rathole, never to be seen again.  Our economy is not a zero sum game - every segment of it is an economic engine in its own right, including healthcare.  I reject the premise that we have a 'crisis' altogether - there are strange incentives and unfunded mandates that have crept in over the past 50 years that have driven the costs up, not due to greed, but due to the relentless infiltration of government into the healthcare industry.  We are where we are today because of our government and that government now wants carte blanche to 'solve' the mess it created with more of the same and essentially kill the economic engine of one sixth of our economy.

What's wrong with rules requiring (private) insurers to pay for treatments, like agreed?

They are selling a product and they are oblieged to guarantee the product's quality. They do not deliver on their promise because they don't have to. Because nothing forces them to. No rules.

Society needs rules and freedoms. Otherwise it's just anarchy and the rule of the strong.

The per capita values indicate effectiveness, though. And by all accounts the US health care system is ineffective and inhumane.

And "the government" that got you into this mess is not the same government that has to drag you out of it. It's the same as saying that the economic crisis is Obama's fault because it happened during his presidency.

But you are right, you have different values and beliefs. And compassion, humanism and justice are apparently not among them.

What garbage.  Amen, indeed.  Respect for human dignity and self-determination does not require a massive forced transfer of wealth from taxpayers and lowest-common-denominator healthcare.

There is nothing compassionate about supporting taking other people's money to give to other people.

Compassion would be YOU giving your own money to someone else voluntarily.

On the site, it had familiar names suck as Ann Coulter, Dick Morris, and Bill O'Reilly. Seems like it's pretty much a Jewish GOP supporting site. Wikipedia agrees with me.

Let's look at some quotes:

"The current "health care" bill threatens to take life-and-death decisions out of the hands of individuals and their doctors, transferring those decisions to Washington bureaucrats." -- multiple democrats have continuously reiterated that the purpose of the current bill is to provide a public option. So, the competition will lower the cost of health care and improve the quality, thus giving those who are constrained by money choices. Explain to me how more choice takes life and death decisions away from us.

"if you preferred to have a nice hospital room with "amenities" rather than being in an unsanitary ward with inadequate nursing care, as under the National Health Service in Britain" -- As smart as this guy may be, he really can't say that without providing some sort of source. He's not a doctor, he's an economist and social commentator, so he can't use himself as a source

"it is as predictable as the sunrise that medical care for the elderly will be cut back under a government-controlled medical system." -- you mean if such a system focused on preventive care, which includes promoting a healthy lifestyle, they government wouldn't need to spend as much money on heart surgeries? okay, I buy that.

"It is part of a whole mindset of many on the left who have never reconciled themselves to an economic system in which how much people can withdraw from the resources of the nation depends on how much they have contributed to those resources." -- That's probably because that's not what the current economic system is. I don't pay fire insurance so that the trucks will come to my house, I pay taxes to contribute to the fire department, which services everyone, even those who would be unable to pay for fire insurance.

On a side note, I know at least one reasons why medicare is costing so much:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_Prescription_Drug,_Improvement,_and_Modernization_Act

quick quote from that:

"it prohibits the Federal government from negotiating discounts with drug companies;" -- so if I were the CEO of a perscription drug company, I'd want to charge Medicare a lot more for the same quality drugs so I have bigger profits and then the shareholders like me more?

That sounds like the people who voted that legislation in (repubicans in '03) were trying to make Medicare bankrupt.