k, so how about minmaxclose buttons that don't look just like every other one....and just like the default Win 7?

Back in the dim dark past people showed real diversity by even moving them....elsewhere.

I guess my interpretation of 'far away as possible' is too literal.

Come on, man.... function is not your one and only God.  Art [skinning] is creativity not practical mediocrity....

Push the envelope....

Yes....there's still time to save your soul...

I haven't done a WB skin in ages...but I'm fairly sure you can still move them anywhere...sides...bottom, etc.

You know....there's a world out there where you can actually be proud that your WB is not popular....where people may concede it is well executed and/or unique....popularity is merely for the commercial and commercialism sacrifices just too much to be the sole tenet of design ALL the time.

Popularity doesn't define how 'good' anything is....just how popular it is.....hence the tag.

The only 'design element' that is really dodgey to ignore is the default windows light-source....where to do so confuses the heck out of the result if/when put alongside elements not skinned by the WB....tends to make a bellybutton look like an 'outie' when it's supposed to be an 'innie'.

I'm looking forward to the day when you say "stuff popularity....I'm going to design purely for design's sake" ...

In Architecture you have [usually] 'one client' for whom you design.  What you create only needs to be 'conservative/mediocre' if part of the brief is that the client will be quite transient and thus the building needs to be 'popularly saleable'.

If they [the client/s] will be the sole user....in other words it's designed for THEM, not others then envelopes get pushed.

Gladly.

Design should have an underlying subtext...."fuck conservatism" ....

Now why would I want that? My goal is to be the best. Popular or not, if it ends up being more popular.. too.. then hey.. bonus.

...and how much income can be derived for ones bills and family which, to be frank is my #1 concern. (being an artiste, even the best, comes second) Lest we forget this became a profession for me many moons ago.

As far as clients go, each and every person that buys one of my themes I consider.. a client \ customer and my work, obviously reflects what I think they will like overall... as well as a personal inner drive to provide quality\ease of use\length of use. A happy customer is typically a repeat customer.

Have no illusions , as much as I love what I do, I am first and foremost in this to provide for my family, and in being so, popular is not only good, its manditory.

In Win 7 per pixel I'm fairly positive you can not... and frankly.. having buttons on the side is 1. not terribly creative 2. not very functional  3. pretty offputting.

To be perfectly honest, I don't think I would move them if I could, Titlebuttons are one area that binds familiarity. in the words of some great man.. just because you can, doesnt mean you should.

now now, lets not get political   I'm a fiscal and social Reagan conservative at heart... that it should spill over.. not a shocker.

Well, the start button is a total winner and as usual, you're making very balanced decisions between the art and the marketability and that's completely understandable...especially since the art is so excellent. I'm truly impressed by your judgment here. Very well done, John.

As for the branding? I'd love to see a pair of fangs with a drop of venom...or a scorpion's stinger with a drop of venom...just a thought.

hehe reminds of this

http://www.offensive-security.com/backtrack-wallpaper.jpg

Interesting conversation between John and Paul.

I have been a long time admirer of John's work and his work is always 'out of the top drawer'. I have virtually all his skins..........some bought by me and others were bought by friends and family for Xmas and Birthday pressies. You can see that John puts a huge amount of effort - heart and soul - into each skin and that shows in the quality - but not just quality. Looking at his skins...........they vary from being minimilistic to quite complex.........but never overdone. There are many skins in 'his box' - of different types - that would suit everyone's taste. This one certainly looks very promising. Finally, one area that I tend to judge a skin is how long it stays on my desktop and what matching gadgets and widgets I can put with it...............I would say the Sexy and Naked Noir WB's have been virtually the only skins on my laptop for ages.

ask a few one legged or widowed Indonesian islanders about the Komodo

Seriously, thank-you everyone for your comments and interest, certainly was interesting.

I believe Paul, under that button pushing surface probably would like to see me excel even more and I don't take his words lightly.. Unfortunately, unless you have walked in my, and some other skinners shoes, it's hard to understand just how difficult WB and the current OS is to make themes that are sky high and grounded at the same time, especially when your asking someone to rob the piggy bank to slap them on their desks.

As far as dragons, its a nice idea, but I don't want to get too cliche with the blind, for the reasons mentioned above.. but.. it is early days.

Watch the new Life special on Discovery.

How about a pic of my ex if you want venom! Snakes would flee from her!  

I'm sure that I posted this already, but it don't seem to be here...

John, I want to do a DX theme, weather, and maybe some docks for this, if you want. This is sweet!

I love the color combination. And the attention to detail that we've become accustomed to from you.

I will be called a suck up but in my book, you are at the very least one of the best. Probably don't mean much coming from me, but I have been a fan for a long time, and aspire to be as good as you.

I understand about feeding your family and paying the bills. Keep doing what you do, John!

So, debate aside...

How's it coming? This is really looking sa-weeet!

Same here...