I am not convinced you did make here a RTS game. The game feels for me soulless, boring and misplaced designed.

By on October 24, 2015 3:24:42 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

ananp

Join Date 06/2014
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Hello I am fan of RTS games. The game is on Early Access in Steam now and I did try it out.

I do play and like Dragon Commander, Starcraft 2 , Starwars Empire at War, Sins of Solar Empire,

Total Annihilation, C&C Red Alert 2, ,Act of Aggression, RUSE and Supreme Commander.

 

 

Well the developers did make so far Turn Based games.

Oxide Games = Civilization V and Stardock = Galactic Civilizations

Its obvious they don't have the experience with Real Time Strategy games
and you do extremely obviously see it by this game.

 

 

It feels like somebody who never played RTS games,

just did look staff from other games and put it randomly together.

Without thinking if its playable or improvable.

 

 

1  Why don't you have here Game Speed Controls ?

There must be option that you can change game speed in menus and set high game speed for multiplayer matches. Like you have in any other RTS game.

 

2 The game itself feels pretty in slow motion, its even slower than Planetary Annihilation.

I do play Supreme Commander and Total Annihilation usually on Max speed.

 

The people can for sure handle a much faster game, at least offer them an ability to play online and 2times or even 4 times faster version than now. For an "little" experienced player who managed at least on medium AI in Total Annihilation or Supreme commander, this one feels extremely underwhelming, boring and unchallenged.


The Normal Speed must be much higher here, like at least doubled.

You feel like the game does have performance issues, why has it to be in this slow motion ?
If you make a game extremely slow, it doesn't make it tactical or strategical.

 

 

3 Well overall it feels like a cheap , bad and soulless Ripoff from SupCom.

3.1 The Units if the do sounds is Ok as long its somehow cool or realistic,

I mean its Ok by zerg in Starcraft ,Bots in Total Annihilation and units from Rise of legends, here its just boring.

3.2 The Music is Boring

 

Its Ok maybe there, but is it real so good idea, to have a game that sound exactly like Supreme Commander ?

 

 

4 Why do you have to start so boring ?

Just 1 Builder and an HQ that spawn builder,

Imean why do I have to waste time by start to buy builders and place production facilities for the units ? It all feels misplaced.

Its a pointless repetitive start you designed here, which does kill of the fun, and it takes literally 5 minutes every time over and over again just to repeat it , not play it.  Its really bad because you don't have here any point to make with your base something different than your enemies. You will only place same stuff over and over again and same point, by really lame speed and not play till you got your stuff ready.I t's a really bad design, like by game developers from Electronic Arts.

Just give people by start 4 builders 1000 Credits and already 2 facilities to make ground and Air Units. Why do you have to put by the 4 "metal extractors" around your base by yourself the metal extractor on ? Why not simple already place there the 4 "metal extractors" ? It would save every player 5 minutes of boring start up.

Look SuCom2 you have 3 Builders by start , not 1. And you can start with 4 metal extractors already build.

 

 

5 The resource system itself, I mean you can't meanwhile invent nothing new, so most stuff will be familiar,

but still if you do design this, look maybe at least how its done right.

SupCOm 2 does highlight it "metal" with green on the map, so you do know easy where to place your Metal extractor,

if you do obviously knew there is such game like Supreme Commander 2, why don't you at least compare ?

 

 

6 Why do you have here such small Pictures to buy units or buildings, really people, make them bigger.


7 Planetary annihilation and SupCOm, RUSE do have this vide area Icon Unit view
Really pretty missed here too.

 

 

For me personal Ashes of the Singularity doesn't feel like a video game.

Well this is what Early Access is for try out the game and say what to improve or fix.

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October 24, 2015 6:45:40 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

You can use the + and - to change game speed. Did you already try all the difficulty of the AI for a better challenge? There is also an option to adjust the UI scale but I'm afraid it isn't perfectly clean yet

As for myself I'm happy to see a different flavour of RTS' . There are already a lot of fast paced ones. Maybe an outstanding resume in turn based games is needed to try that move. I understand you don't like the game at least in is current state. But it brings value to terrain as no other rts ever has. The slow moving units make unit placement a costly desicion if wrong. It' s true that the player time isn't anymore the rarest ressource in the game it's a big change I'd like to see where it goes. I hope in the coming months it'll be the player's anticipation capacity if it's not yet.

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October 24, 2015 6:47:26 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Quoting Gatokatcha,

You can use the + and - to change game speed. Did you already try all the difficulty of the AI for a better challenge? There is also an option to change the UI scale but I'm afraid it isn't perfectly clean yet.

As for myself I'm happy to see a different flavour of RTS' . There are already a lot of fast paced ones. Maybe an outstanding resume in turn based games is needed to try that move. I understand you don't like the game at least in is current state. But it brings value to terrain as no other rts ever has. The slow moving units make unit placement a costly desicion if wrong. It' s true that the player time isn't anymore the rarest ressource in the game it's a big change I'd like to see where it goes. I hope in the coming months it'll be the player's anticipation capacity if it's not yet.

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October 24, 2015 6:48:00 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

sorry wrong button

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October 24, 2015 7:32:58 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

I did use the + and - to change game speed. its like just 5% faster, lol

 

I don't use DX12 version , I play DX11 version.
I do play vs AI , there its not really faster if you hit + . just feels like a slight 5% faster, that not a true game speed option.

My machine does mach the recommend stuff  except the Grafik card , I do have GeForce GTX 870M.

 

Yes it OK that a game does have with slow motion, but it must offer Normal game speed and fast game speed too.

Like you do have in Supreme commander.

 

Again the fastes the game Ashes does here perform is equal if you slow down in Supreme commander.
Its ridiculous here, every average RTS play usually does handle much faster games.

Its even slower here than C&C Tiberium Wars or Red Alert 3, Which are designed for new and inexperienced players.

 

 

As I see on the forum several people did already complain about the game speed here.

 

Just say its early version isn't an excuse if the game isn't enjoyable.
I just can't understand how a developer can release such version of his own game,

which he wants to sell and is aware that on steam people can refund anytime the game.
Ether the developer here don't know what is required from an RTS game or he has here performance problems.

I dont know maybe the guys should first try other RTS games out and than compare what they did with other games.

 

This are free games with game speed controls.
Try them out and look maybe what you can imporve by yours.



StarCraft II: Starter Edition-
http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/StarCraft_II:_Starter_Edition

The Dawn of the Tiberium Age
http://www.moddb.com/mods/the-dawn-of-the-tiberium-age


The Protectors is a stand-alone mod of the game Warlords Battlecry 3.
http://www.moddb.com/games/the-protectors

 

 

You do have there much faster gameplay even on the low speed.

Most RTS players are used too much faster game speed that you do have in Ashes of Singularity, its just boring to play a slow motion game only.

 

 

So my Points



1 Add real game speed adjustment options which does double and triple the speed here.
2 Make option for a faster start up with 4 builders, 2 production facilities, different amount of starting resources and already 4 build metal extractors.
3 And really increase the Normal speed you do offer here.

 

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October 24, 2015 7:44:20 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

will echo Gatokatcha, there is the + and- keys and there was talk about increasing the game start speed to be faster then what it is currently. that said I agree that it could be nice to have that option in the lobby. Still there are things would rather see get done before that is implemented as I can still change game speed in game.

 

3.

I think the sounds and music is actually quite good for this stage of development. The unit sounds little more like the robotic Protoss units from starcraft rather then supcom, and think it fits well with the game's atmosphere.

 

4.

I could see this being added as an option down the line for those quick start games but I wouldn't want to see it become default. I can use that time to consider last minute changes to strategy or try something crazy. with the kind of start that you have suggested, I think it will end up taking some early choices away from the player.

I know SC2 Legacy of the void has changed their start up a bit to get to the action faster but only added more workers to start with.

6

maybe slightly bigger but overall think the icon sizes are fine as is, they are pretty easily selectable and may even be larger then most other rts games currently.

 

Stardock does have some experiences with rts if not making then playing, They did publish sins of a solar empire.

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October 24, 2015 8:07:50 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Like you said you might want yo get a refund. You still could buy it back later if the game evolve favorably in your eyes. I certainly hope it retains that unique pace. I feel there is enough to do even at the beginning while you grab the second ring of region with a few hermes.Later  I think the gameplay requires some time to correctly mount an assault. But I guess that  just me; even the normal AI  is a challenge for me. 

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October 24, 2015 11:26:02 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Quoting ananp,
3.2 The Music is Boring

 

hey now !

 

Quoting ananp,

1 Add real game speed adjustment options which does double and triple the speed here.
2 Make option for a faster start up with 4 builders, 2 production facilities, different amount of starting resources and already 4 build metal extractors.
3 And really increase the Normal speed you do offer here.

while I was mostly in agreement with some (of the less personal attack parts) of your original post, I feel like what you ask for here is really a weak and rather unrelated answer to the issues you brought up.

It doesn't change drastically the spirit of the game to add prebuilt. it's just adds prebuilt to the game. I don't understand why that would be revolutionary to you. 

 

but either way there is a similar option for prebuilt already in the game that makes all the regions already have mass and radioactive points built and all you have to do is covert the VP point and they're yours.

(I don't know if that does it for you, personally I don't like that game mode)

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October 24, 2015 11:37:17 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

>The Normal Speed must be much higher here, like at least doubled.

 

No, no, no dear god, no. Let's not have yet another high speed twitch fest based around reflexes and winning by being efficient to the second never even blinking. As it stands things are shaping up well to need a little planning and thought or get punished by the AI. An old school RTS where planning, some strategic thought and tactical skill rather than FPS style ramp up the speed, mass produce as much as possible as fast as possible and then Zerg is long over due. It's not a case of being able to handle it or not, it's more a choice of something which gives you time to come up with differing strategies and approaches refining you tactics throughout the game rather than a race to be the most efficient in churning out the exec min/max right mix of units the quickest to overwhelm the opposition.

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October 24, 2015 12:14:12 PM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

In my opinion nothing the OP said indicates this is not a RTS game. What a strange comment. I'm sure the devs can provide their RTS resumes on demand if needed, that would be silly.

As for me, I can just about keep up with what's going on in the game on normal speed. Once I get fluent with the UI maybe I can go a notch higher, but probably not much more. Also, in my opinion we can't truly evaluate game speed until unit teleport gets in the game. Teleport brings up the overall pace, to a degree.

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October 24, 2015 12:58:44 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

While I think the pace of the game and speed of units could be slightly faster, doubling it or tripling it is ridiculous. This is a large scale macro RTS. Somewhere in between the pace of Sins of a Solar Empire and SupCom:FA is fine. The maxed out + speed is more than a 5% increase, I'm sure. We need a default standard for multiplayer and I'd say maybe 10% faster than what is fastest currently would be a happy medium.

My main concern with the game is its optimization. I meet the recommended specs but only get about 30-40 fps on medium settings. The game has a high barrier to entry in terms of specs which is a little concerning in terms of getting a large, healthy multiplayer population. They seem partnered with AMD and there's been this small PR war of words with Nvidia, whose cards seem to do slightly worse performance wise with the game. I know its pre-beta though so I'm hoping that's going to improve (and that new drivers may help too).

The other concern is depth to the game - in terms of usable tactics and depth of research. Right now, it's fairly shallow compared to Sins of a Solar Empire. But of course we only have one faction and pre-beta to go by. Unit options, research options, economy options, structure options, etc. are what I mean here. It wasn't just that Sins had more of all these, but it had synergistic ways they linked together that led to different viable strategies. The tech hype and pretty explosions and "moar units!" smashing together needs to give way to focusing on the depth of gameplay options they'll be giving players imo. So something to wait and watch as development goes on here...I do like the addition of the Company of Heroes style economy sectors on the  map. I like the art style and aesthetic although I also understand the "soulless" comment the OP had - without any voices or unique characters (even unique super units like the experimentals) or much faction lore yet, it's still missing a bit of personality. It's early days though and with more depth to the game and better optimization, I could see it turn into something special.

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October 24, 2015 3:15:52 PM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

I love Sins of Solar Empire, , this game does have fans , but still you do have even there much better speed up option and more deep gameplay than here, its more a Space4X RTS game. But still It did have a lot of performance Problems, thats why it never get the popularity it deserved and here seems to be performance Problems again.

 

 

I am not talking about to delete this slow mod for beginners,

I am talking to add game mode for Average RTS players and Pro gamers.

Let the people decide online what Mod they want, I am for sure even the slow Motion fans will get enough guys to play a match.

 

 

Again I dont see here a RTS game, more some guys who never did play one did put random stuff together, just because you can start a game build and move units , its not a game. You need atmosphere and something that keep the people entertained and doesn't bore them.

 

 

Look my game experience here so far. I start, can only repeat same thing and don't have any diversity in what I can do. I can't decide if i buy tank, Air or mech factory like in PA. I have here only 1 kind of Production facility by the start, for Air units you need here more, you cant buy them by start.



Than I start to take resources, and honestly there does the game die for me! Its repetitive embarrassing , so I am bored. Than after i did waste 5 min just to buy the basic start stuff, my enemy had to do exactly the same, we both just wasted our time, because we can't do here nothing to be different. So we meet at the center of the map and than starts the fight, only from this point on the game does truly start , for the both player, till this they just will each mach repeat just preparing same stuff over and over again.



For Example in TA I can decide if I buy bot factory or Tank Factory, so I have different units that can attack,
and by much higher basic speed.

 

Yes there are people who think its OK, but a game must unite a bigger group of customers.

 

 

Look maybe this , It sounds like the game you did create.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFgVtpcHWuA

 

Look I can shut down Air units and Marine Units in SupCom, so I have exactly the same game like here lol.


It sound the same, and looks similar, but does have an extreme lame gameplay, does have a lot of repetitive preparation stuffand the worst extreme slow motion battles. 

 

 

 

 

Let em maybe compare it how it feels if it would be shooter.
so Supreme commander = Call of Duty.
Ashes of Singularity would be a shooter without Snipers and shotguns, OK, would be look and sound extreme the same OK, but the troopers cantrun or jump. , they can only walk. And the walk even slower than in CoD.
But you have each time to choose for your trooper around 5 minutes long his load out before the game starts, but the only load out he has is a gun, so you wait em 4.50 till the game start, that you must capture spawn points, after running for the first spawn pouint for 5 min, you have to run to the next 5 min, only than you finely meet the enemy. 

 

The developers do have no experience in making such RTS games with base build,

Sins of a Solar Empire is a completely different kind of RTS games.

 

 

 

I do see potential here, but the developer obviously didn't realize what he is working on.

Just try out the free2play C&C game. I did mentioned before, see how they managed game speed controls.

 

 

I didn't develop here the feeling to play a RTS game.

The way you did create the base build up and the dynamic of the battlefield feels notto match for me.

 

 

There is no point to force each player to place the first 4 metal extractors by himself.

You just do bore him, my enemy does do exactly the same in this time. So what the point to let both players waste their time with this ?

 

 

In SupCom for example I do have 3 builders, so one of them can go out and maybe block somewhere with towers or I could just make air bombers or go on with walking ships from behind enemy lines, I have lot of different outcomes. In SC2 I have to decide if rush, expand or bunker. In CnC I just start with lot of money and do place fast my staff. And can choose there troopers, tanks or air units.

 

 

Here you have only 1 kind of units by start, these 3 hower things and fighting air units are unlocked later on, the first "expansions" you do take in exactly same time as your opponent" , so you dont have this kind of diversity compare to most other RTS games.

This way it would start to bore most average RTS players. + this slow motion is an extrme fun killer.

 

 

 

Yes its nice that you make a simply RTS game for beginners , low skilled player or people who want have a calm game and dont have problems to repeat same stuff that doesn't change the outcome of the game over and over again,but I expect entertainment and don't find it here.

I did read here about game speed before here and on steam, but it doesn't feel like the game becomes faster.

 

So for multipayer matches it need double and tripple speed and make option to start with more ressource, prepared base with 4 builders and some basic buildings already placed like 1 till 3 production buildings and resource mining facilities.

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October 24, 2015 5:16:26 PM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

http://bonpatron.com/en/

could you please paste your texts chunk by chunk (their limit is 2000 characters) into this website and review all the corrections before posting it?

this will allow for your posts to be semi-legible as right now they're hodgepodge words thrown together that result in a lump of text from which you can't make much sense.

no harm meant.

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October 24, 2015 6:55:45 PM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Clearly the OP was never in the SupCom beta.

 

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October 25, 2015 3:59:26 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

From the Ashes website FAQ (http://www.ashesofthesingularity.com/game/faq#gameplay), regarding game speed :  

Ashes is not designed to be a game that rewards clicking speed. Its pacing is more akin to Sins of a Solar Empire.

I purchased it for this and for the meta-units. I actually slow the game down in single player if I want to plan some base building and don't want to worry about my armies blundering into something whilst I'm messing around.

 

 

 

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October 25, 2015 6:28:44 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

1 People do have different skill levels,

for some Starcraft doesn't reward clicking speed.

And some people do say that C&C on Slow does reward clicking speed.

 

 

2 It was Promised to add here game speed Controls, but this option isn't here in proper working conditions.

 

3 At this point the game is not akin with Sins of a Solar Empire,

even there you do have much faster gameplay and but the game Sins of a Solar Empire itself is pretty slow.

 

4 The game is just a bad copy of SupCom2.

Similarities:
The game does sound the same. Same music, same unit vioces, looks from design akin to SupCom2.
SupCom 2 needs just do change some gameplay options to be played like this game, its from 2010. So you expect people to pay 50 bugs for this 5 years after SupCom2 release ?

 



5 Well if the game would at least offer a legit gameplay ,that could be ok, but to be honest ,

it is pretty bad done here.


In Ashes of the Singularity has no deep or different game play.

You have just 3 ground Offensive units at start. So you will never build up something different from your enemy or go with any different strategy as your enemy.  You do by start build exact same buildings in same order as your opponent, it does do no impact on game progress. So buy a second builder, place metal extractors and place facility that does build ground units.

This stuff can be given to both players at start without only difference, they spare 3 minutes of waiting time till they prepared.

So at this point people would see after some matches that they do just waste their time.

 

The start in this game, for the first 5 minutes is  monotonic and repetitious.

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October 25, 2015 8:00:06 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Quoting DaBang,

Ashes is not designed to be a game that rewards clicking speed. Its pacing is more akin to Sins of a Solar Empire.

that's the problem.

 

so far it's not the case. because of units being very random in their movements, you obtain better results (faster movement, dodging more shots, ect...) by microing units intensely, which consists only of massive clickspamming.

 

to fix this it's simple :

  • remove random hovering about
  • make speed (and acceleration (and basically unit movement all around)) be 100% consistent 
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October 25, 2015 9:56:01 AM from Ashes of the Singularity Forums Ashes of the Singularity Forums

Bottom lime: if you didn't like sins of a solar empire you will probably not like ashes. There are other games that might suit your tastes.

 

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