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PaulLach
PaulLach
Join Date 08/2015
+78

Cannot Load Citizen Onto Transport Under 1.60.388302

June 11, 2023 6:37:43 PM from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

I ran into an issue trying to load a citizen onto a transport ship.  I had successfully loaded citizens onto transport ships during this game, but now they will not load and I do not get an error message of any kind telling me why I cannot load them onto the ship.

Here is a link to a save file that should let you replicate the issue:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/wooeu1gc6fy77g8uqb9ls/Cannot-Load-Citizen-Under-1.60.388302.GC4Sav?dl=0&rlkey=ovmfubqe480iw3djp8dl44vo7

Here are the steps to reproduce the issue after loading the save file:

  1. Go to the Apeori Shipyard 1.  It should look like the first screen snapshot below.
    1. Notice that there are 2 transports in the shipyard.
  2. Click on one of the transports to select it.
  3. Right-click on a cell a couple of cells away from the shipyard to get the transport to try to move out of the shipyard.
    1. Your should get a window that looks like the second screen snapshot below.
  4. Try to drag any of the 3 citizens in the "Available Citizens" section over into the "Citizens Aboard" section.
    1. The game will not let you load any of the citizens onto the transport and it will not tell you why not.

I recommend creating an error message that tells the player why they cannot load a citizen onto the transport.

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PaulLach
PaulLach
Join Date 08/2015
+78
Reply #1 June 11, 2023 6:56:01 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

I figured-out why the citizens would not load - I only had 4 Control and the game apparently requires 5 Control to load a citizen onto a transport.  On my next turn I tried to load a citizen and it worked, but my control went from 6 (4 + 2 from the new month) down to 1.  Then I could not load another citizen onto another transport.

I think the requirement of 5 Control to load a citizen onto a ship is excessive for the following reasons:

  1. The game already requires that a citizen be moved from the core world associated with the shipyard to the ship, reducing the number of citizens on the core world.  If you are going to require something more than just a citizen it should be something that the core world that sponsors the shipyard can create.
  2. Players do not have many decisions they can make about how to increase Control like they can for Income, Citizens, and Resources.
  3. Control has generally been used for executing Executive Orders, not creating or loading ships.

I strongly suggest that you drop the Control cost for loading citizens onto ships.

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PaulLach
gypsy2299
Join Date 09/2003
+103
Reply #2 June 11, 2023 7:03:06 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

Quoting PaulLach,
reply 1

I figured-out why the citizens would not load - I only had 4 Control and the game apparently requires 5 Control to load a citizen onto a transport.  On my next turn I tried to load a citizen and it worked, but my control went from 6 (4 + 2 from the new month) down to 1.  Then I could not load another citizen onto another transport.

I think the requirement of 5 Control to load a citizen onto a ship is excessive for the following reasons:

 

    1. The game already requires that a citizen be moved from the core world associated with the shipyard to the ship, reducing the number of citizens on the core world.  If you are going to require something more than just a citizen it should be something that the core world that sponsors the shipyard can create.

 

    1. Players do not have many decisions they can make about how to increase Control like they can for Income, Citizens, and Resources.

 

    1. Control has generally been used for executing Executive Orders, not creating or loading ships.

 


I strongly suggest that you drop the Control cost for loading citizens onto ships.

Never should have been added.

I was about to ask you a question on your first post, and you answered it with the first sentence of this one. 

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PaulLach
Old-Spider
Join Date 04/2006
+152
Reply #3 June 11, 2023 11:02:40 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

I had this problem several days ago.  I couldn't figure out why I couldn't load the ship.  I decided to do something else and forgot about it.  A few turns later I remembered the ship and tried again.  It worked.  I had no idea why.

Quoting PaulLach,
reply 1

I figured-out why the citizens would not load - I only had 4 Control and the game apparently requires 5 Control to load a citizen onto a transport.

I'm sure you just explained why my problem occurred and why it went away.

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PaulLach
Illauna
Join Date 09/2006
+84
Reply #4 June 13, 2023 3:09:55 AM
from Galactic Civilizations III ForumsGalactic Civilizations III Forums

Ok you just confirmed what I thought could happen. I'll replicate this and post. I don't think the constructors is intended the problem is your changing your citizens job to Engineer and changing jobs cost 5 control. 

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PaulLach
PaulLach
Join Date 08/2015
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Reply #5 June 13, 2023 12:48:36 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

Quoting Illauna,
reply 4

Ok you just confirmed what I thought could happen. I'll replicate this and post. I don't think the constructors is intended the problem is your changing your citizens job to Engineer and changing jobs cost 5 control. 

I am not sure what you were trying to say, but here are the issues with Control:

  1. The game was changed to require 5 control to load a citizen onto a transport or a constructor.
    1. This seriously limits players ability to choose to build and populate these types of ships.
      1. We already have to "spend" a citizen and "spend" shipyard construction time.  Why did you feel it is necessary to add a cost of 2.5 months of contol to the cost of these ships?
  2. The game was changed to require 5 control to train a citizen as anything other than a worker.
    1. This is a problem because the game assigns a "skill" as each citizen is created, often selecting a subobtimal skill which requires the player to train the citizen to a more appropriate skill at a cost of 5 control.  You could allow players to assign each new citizen to a skill for free and then charge them a more appropriate 1 or 2 control to change skills.
  3. The game only gives 2 control per month.  Yes, you have added ways to get individual chunks of control, but no way that I can see to increase monthly control earned.
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PaulLach
Publius of NV
Join Date 08/2002
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Reply #6 June 13, 2023 1:03:30 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

Since the job of the citizen changes when loaded onto a transport or constructor, perhaps this was an unintentional side effect of the change to require 5 control to retrain workers? Anyway, I'm not a fan of any control requirement for changing citizens jobs, it wasn't broken, didn't need fixing.

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PaulLach
scifi1950
Join Date 02/2005
+121
Reply #7 June 13, 2023 1:04:28 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

Paul - "Bureaucratic Offices" is the only other improvement that gives control that I know of.  1 per planet (just core worlds except capital) - only .1 control per turn.  You'd have to have a fairly large empire to make a significant impact, and that's pretty hard to do as the game is currently configured.

  

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PaulLach
Illauna
Join Date 09/2006
+84
Reply #8 June 13, 2023 2:27:28 PM
from Galactic Civilizations IV ForumsGalactic Civilizations IV Forums

Quoting PaulLach,
reply 5


Quoting Illauna,
reply 4

Ok you just confirmed what I thought could happen. I'll replicate this and post. I don't think the constructors is intended the problem is your changing your citizens job to Engineer and changing jobs cost 5 control. 



I am not sure what you were trying to say, but here are the issues with Control:

 

    1. The game was changed to require 5 control to load a citizen onto a transport or a constructor.

        1. This seriously limits players ability to choose to build and populate these types of ships.

            1. We already have to "spend" a citizen and "spend" shipyard construction time.  Why did you feel it is necessary to add a cost of 2.5 months of contol to the cost of these ships?




 

    1. The game was changed to require 5 control to train a citizen as anything other than a worker.

        1. This is a problem because the game assigns a "skill" as each citizen is created, often selecting a subobtimal skill which requires the player to train the citizen to a more appropriate skill at a cost of 5 control.  You could allow players to assign each new citizen to a skill for free and then charge them a more appropriate 1 or 2 control to change skills.


 

    1. The game only gives 2 control per month.  Yes, you have added ways to get individual chunks of control, but no way that I can see to increase monthly control earned.

 


 

Was typing at 2 AM in the morning, when I as tired...

 

There are a few ways of gaining control but it is still a very limited rate. I'm pretty sure there is an improvement that increaes by .1 per world. Even if this change is to remain there is so many gotcha scenarios that I found and shared it's a major problem. 

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