AI starting abilities

That's why I am getting my butt kicked.
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I think we must clearly discuss what is cheating and what isn't:
- Stardock has stated numerous times that the AI play the same game like you. This means that they must choose at the beginning a political party (war party give 50% hp) and 10 picks
- How can you adjust difficulty if you can't give advantages/disadvantage to your adversary?

Personnally, I don't consider that an AI that have only starting advantages is cheating.

Great comments Peace Phoenix. If the AI did not have the slight edge it has the game would be a bit boring..

I am struggling on Challenging level playing it my first time. They have more of an advantage the higher up in levels you go.

It's known that the AI gets some starting advantages when you choose higher than "Intelligent", i.e. "Genius" and "Incredible".

Furthermore when you use mods, the AI can use the new parties, ships etc. as well. Thus there can be quite hight starting values for some abilities.

Additionally the AI has some smarter attack strategies etc. It's still no match for a human player but when you compare it to other games it's simply great.

It was asked to get two separate options for "intelligence" and "advantages" but the developer did not like the idea. I guess this would be to complicated for Metaverse and to explain it to ordinary gamers ...

Please don't call it cheating. The developers hate this word. They are very responsive to our wishes and needs and we don't wont to upset them

Conclusion: When you want to have a AI with the same starting position you have (with the exception that they know the position of yellow stars) then start the AI on "Intelligent".

About AI knowing where yellow stars are, it should be considered as if the AI know stellar cartography. And the path to stellar cartography is :
communication theory -> universal translator -> nano electronics -> stellar cartography
So you may be able (in important universe) to get know where yellow stars are without having finished your colonisation wave.

And you can always sell it to the AI because they never build it

Hold on a second. Peace Phoenix. By what I've stated above, it should be clear that the AIs receive substantial bonuses far beyond what is termed 'legal' as far as party & picks goes. Furthermore, Stardock has made repeated claims that the AI does not cheat on "Intelligent" or below. Moreover, granting non-legal bonuses is cheating, which is hardly subjective.

Litcube, Perhaps the game is designed they way it might actually happen. I would not consider it cheating if an alien race had the advantage on me. The advantage does not last long. If you let the intro go all of the way through with out clicking you can see someone landing on a human planet finding a girl with a teddy bear. I don't think he came for tea with the way it clinches its fists. Sure they have big bonuses. Design a political party that has big bonuses and some negatives so the alien AI won't take it and play. You may not be able to submitt to meta but I see that you haven't so for anyway. Also the AI plays to a set of "rules". It dosent learn from game to game how us reckless humans alter our tactics. If you are weal they will attack. Unless you have good diplo. Take for instance, has an AI ever broke an alliance with you? I have never seen it. But I have made alliances to let the ai do my work for me. When I get strong enough I take my allys planents with all of there improvements and techs and I go to the top. By then its after 2190 fininsh with a couple bribes and you have won. I don't think they cheat. I would expect them to have advantages over me. That is what makes the game more difficult. And I am still fairly new to the game.

Fuels Chief, my comments above, and more importantly, the purpose of my thread, is to bear proof that the AI cheats. Weather or not this cheating is for good or ill, and that it makes the AI harder and perhaps more enjoyable to some, is absolutely irrelevant. My beef is that Stardock has spelled out the difficulty levels in many interviews and have claimed again and again that the AI doesn't cheat and it plays the game like you do.

I just did another test on "Normal". The AI starts out with abilities that look suspicious to say the least.

Could you show us your facts, and how you have collected them? We all would like to see proof of what you advance, and how you have been able to see AI stats rights form the start.
We also must known if mods are installed, and what tech have the AI when you are able to get their stats

So I guess that in any game where there is an handicap for one player, the others are cheating since they haven't this handicap.

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Litcube I disagree with you. But I respect your right to say it.

Peace Phoenix, Stardock themselves, in this context, uses the term cheating. They've claimed the AI "doesn't cheat". They used the word.

Fuels Chief, what exactly is it that you disagree with me about?

Here's the facts: I created a map where there was only 1 planet per one star per one race, and included all races. I started a new game and performed the following:

-Set all AI's to same level
-Turned cheat keys on
-CTRL-U
-CTRL-SHIFT-S
-Advanced espionage to max for each race
-Repeated turns until I achieved medium level espionage on all races, at which point I can see the AIs stats. Takes roughly 20 turns or so. No mods.

I repeated this list for all of the AIs. Of course not all the races are the same. They take their picks, just as Stardock claims, but they also have bonuses in at least 9 - 12 areas. My findings:

Starting at Fool:
--------------------
Economy +10%, + 5%/AI level
Defense +1%, + 2%/AI level
Morale +3%, + 3%/AI level
Research +12%, +3%/AI level
Influence +3%, +3%/AI level
Trade +3%, +3%/AI level
Diplomacy +12%, +2%/AI level
Hit Points +1%, +1%/AI level
Interest +1%, +1%/AI level

Also, weapons starts a 1% at beginner and increased by 1% every level thereafter.
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Ok, you have conviced me that AI have bonus at any level. I think you forgot at least one: AI have PQ bonus at higher level.

It would be better if you have checked the debug. err file to know what tech have the AI (and the asscoiated abiity bonus) since universal translator give 10% in diplomacy.

But still, I don't consider these bonus given at start as cheat.

Litcube, I'm not a modder (nor have I experimented with the cheat feature) so please bear my question.

Did you take into account that in 20 turns the AIs may have racked up some points while exploring anomolies? Or is this something you can turn off while modding (or in cheat mode)?

Well, perhaps. This thread should answer your question.

http://www.galciv.com/forum.asp?BID=GF&id=194613#194646