Carter is a Statesman.

Give him a chance.

from JoeUser Forums

If George Bush, Condoleeza Rice and Tony Blair--and many others before them--cannot solve the Palestinian problem, why criticize Jimmy Carter for trying to do something about it by meeting Hamas.

I doubt Carter will make significant headway but the US government feels he should not be talking to the "bad boys". How do you make any progress if you don't talk to the enemy? How do you justify criticism when your own policy on Palestine is ineffective and goes no further than "peace-speak'" but not "action-speak".

Give Carter a chance---He has done a darn sight more for the World than Rice or Blair!

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Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Give Carter a chance---He has done a darn sight more for the World than Rice or Blair!
End of quote


He had his chance. And he made it worse. You dont give the keys to the firehouse to a pyromaniac.

There are worse things than doing nothing.
Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top

DrG

It didnt help the time frame he was in. The way I see it, the president is only part of the solution. Everyone has to be willing to work for it to happen. If Carter can get that to happen, the right on, but this is Israel-Palestine we're talking about, and they've been hating each other for quite a while. So, while I applaud him, and the efforts, I have doubts.

Offworld Trading Company
Reply #3 from Stardock Forums Top

Jimmy Carter is a disgrace to the office he once held, he has proven he is an anti-semite, he is the only ex-president to every disrespect a sitting president. It was his lack of action the has made Iran the threat they are now.

Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
So, while I applaud him, and the efforts, I have doubts.
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I would expect nothing less from you. Liberals do not care about results, only intentions. And that is what scares me. The road to hell is paved with the best of intentions.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
So, while I applaud him, and the efforts, I have doubts.I would expect nothing less from you. Liberals do not care about results, only intentions. And that is what scares me. The road to hell is paved with the best of intentions.
End of quote


Dude, you assumed and are an ass because of it. Did I say anything about wanting only effort? I want results, I want there to be peace there, but I know that realistically it's difficult with the animosity and hate. If carter can do his best, and there are results, then good.
Reply #6 from Stardock Forums Top

Carter trashes the U.S. Consitution, which assigns foreign policy to the Executive Branch.  Yes, he has every right to travel and speak as he pleases, but he doesn't go as a private citizen, he goes with his credentials as Former President.  The official policy of the US is that we don't negotiate with terrorists.  The ONLY thing that Carter can accomplish by his folly is to undermine the US.  If someone did this while Carter was president he would be just as mad as the present administration.  It shows his total lack of class, professionalism and integrity.

He should go back to doing humanitarian work, he was great  there and did a lot of good.

 

Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
official policy of the US is that we don't negotiate with terrorists
End of quote


someone shoulda told reagan. i seem to remember him sending a chocolate cake & a bible...along with missle parts illegally purchased from the israelis...to the very same ayatollahs who'd held our countrymen & women hostage for all those months.

If someone did this while Carter was president he would be just as mad as the present administration.
End of quote


do you truly believe there were no negotiations between the incoming reagan administration and the iranians who released those hostages as soon as i-ronnie was inaugurated?

perhaps it was merely a coincidence on the same order and scale as monkeys flyin outta people's butts?
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
Kingbee:
someone shoulda told reagan. i seem to remember him sending a chocolate cake & a bible...along with missle parts illegally purchased from the israelis...to the very same ayatollahs who'd held our countrymen & women hostage for all those months.
End of quote


Hey Kingbee! Haven't seen you for awhile!

Ah, the "October Surprise". What fun the press had with that... without much evidence to back it up.

Besides, that was a different administration. The Executive Branch changes with each administration. Since they are the ones who get to make foreign policy, only the current adminstration's foreign policy matters. Carter is abusing his status to undermine it. Pretty piss poor bit of unprofessionalism there.


do you truly believe there were no negotiations between the incoming reagan administration and the iranians who released those hostages as soon as i-ronnie was inaugurated?

perhaps it was merely a coincidence on the same order and scale as monkeys flyin outta people's butts?
End of quote


No need for a coincidence at all. Reagan made no secret that if he was elected he wasn't going to stand around talking like Carter. He let the terrorist scum in Iran know that they would pay dearly if they held those Americans even one day while his butt was in the big chair in the oval office.

Carter ALWAYS negotiated from weakness. That rarely gets anything done... as evidenced by his neutered administration.
Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
Dude, you assumed and are an ass because of it. Did I say anything about wanting only effort?
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Dude! Show me where I said you wanted only effort? Do not make an ass of yourself. I made a generalized statement, and will hold to it. Your post affirms the stereotype.

Liberals are all about intents, not results. You seem to think it is good that Carter is trying, even if the results are worse than before. That is "intentions" not results.

Learn to read. And stop being an Ass.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
do you truly believe there were no negotiations between the incoming reagan administration and the iranians who released those hostages as soon as i-ronnie was inaugurated?
End of quote


Prove it.

It may be (and I know you are going to deny this, and I will state it is my opinion) that they saw a strong leader that would not hesitate to bomb them back (or just to yesterday considering what the Mullahs did) to the stone age. So they knew they could not pull that shit with Ronnie.

That perception apparently was not only shared by the fruit cakes of Iran, but the democrats as well.

Your allegation has been investigated out the wazoo, and no evidence to even support it has been found. Yet you perist in the myth.
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
Haven't seen you for awhile!
End of quote


eagles weren't lyin even a lil bit; that damn road outta eden is long as hell. if & when it smooths out some, i'm hopin to drop in more frequently. if nothin else, i'm considerably nearer you and all them brats than i've been in years.

Reagan made no secret that if he was elected he wasn't going to stand around talking like Carter. He let the terrorist scum in Iran know that they would pay dearly if they held those Americans even one day while his butt was in the big chair in the oval office.
End of quote


i'm not sure how dearly iran paid for them missle parts (or the chocolate cake for that matter); nearly cost bud mcfarlane his life tho. proclaiming official policy is one thing; implementing it is a whole other story altho i guess notta whole lotta negotiating was involved.




Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
the fruit cakes of Iran
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he gave em fruit cakes too?
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
fruit cakes
End of quote


any idea what kinda cake he hadda feed contra terrorists in nicaragua to get me to take all that money from us?
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
Kingbee: [quote}eagles weren't lyin even a lil bit; that damn road outta eden is long as hell. if & when it smooths out some, i'm hopin to drop in more frequently. if nothin else, i'm considerably nearer you and all them brats than i've been in years. [/quote]

Come on by anytime, I got a freezer full of Brats, a grill that needs to be fired up for the first cookout of the year, and a guitar room to jam in... Come on by anytime.

i'm not sure how dearly iran paid for them missle parts (or the chocolate cake for that matter); nearly cost bud mcfarlane his life tho. proclaiming official policy is one thing; implementing it is a whole other story altho i guess notta whole lotta negotiating was involved.
End of quote


Both Houses of Congress (which were run by Democrats back then), Newsweek, The New Republic and a boat load of reporters itching to be launched into the Woodward & Burnstein Stratosphere.. do you know what they all have in common? After more than a decade of digging, they found nothing....

Maybe you should turn them on to what you know. ;~D


(Now excuse me while I get fitted for a cervical collar) ;~D
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
you smelly old hippy.
End of quote


 :HOT: 

you gots mail.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
I got a freezer full of Brats, a grill that needs to be fired up for the first cookout of the year, and a guitar room to jam in...
End of quote


and all this time i been imaginin there ain't no heaven.

After more than a decade of digging, they found nothing....
End of quote


we must be discussin two different issues.

"A few months ago I told the American people I did not trade arms for hostages. My heart and my best intentions still tell me that's true, but the facts and the evidence tell me it is not. As the Tower board reported, what began as a strategic opening to Iran deteriorated, in its implementation, into trading arms for hostages. This runs counter to my own beliefs, to administration policy, and to the original strategy we had in mind. There are reasons why it happened, but no excuses. It was a mistake"--ronald reagan, "address to the nation on the iran arms and contra aid controversy" (3/4/1987)




Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
Hmmm, actually, I do remember Reagan saying that. The investigations that couldn't find anything were the basic "what did he know and when did he know it" questions about Presidnt Reagan.

Which means you are right, it would have been a case where people outside the Executive Branch were meddling in foreign policy. A lot of people did either go to prison ovre that one. Carter didn't like it back then, so why should he be doing it now?
Reply #18 from JoeUser Forums Top

How do you make any progress if you don't talk to the enemy?
End of quote

You don't talk to your enemies, you kill them.  Only someone like Carter would think that negotiating with islamic loons will result in anything.

 

Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
How do you make any progress if you don't talk to the enemy?
End of quote


Talking is for two countries that want to come to mutually beneficial agreements. There are no mutually beneficial outcomes with Islamist extremists. There is only us dead or them.

They have proven that decades aren't too long for them to continue the fight. It's pretty pathetic of Carter to want to discuss terms of surrender after only half a decade of returning fire.

He isn't there to discuss peace, he's there to discuss terms of US surrender.
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top
the fruit cakes of Iran
he gave em fruit cakes too?
End of quote


Nah - that would be like shipping coals to Newcastle.
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
How do you make any progress if you don't talk to the enemy?Talking is for two countries that want to come to mutually beneficial agreements. There are no mutually beneficial outcomes with Islamist extremists. There is only us dead or them.They have proven that decades aren't too long for them to continue the fight. It's pretty pathetic of Carter to want to discuss terms of surrender after only half a decade of returning fire.He isn't there to discuss peace, he's there to discuss terms of US surrender.
End of quote


You don't know that. We've made strides in Iraq because we've talked with "Islamist extremists" and others. I'm sorry you don't see that, and just end up perpetuating bloodshed.

Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
You don't know that. We've made strides in Iraq because we've talked with "Islamist extremists" and others. I'm sorry you don't see that, and just end up perpetuating bloodshed.
End of quote


What strides were ever made in Iraq before the war? Hussein took Kuwait.. did talks free Kuwait from Hussein's rapists and thugs? NO. What did 12 years of "diplomacy" do after the ceasefire was signed? It made Hussein and a few UN officials a lot richer.

Carter has NO authority to speak for the nation. He has no right to play wannnabe diplomat while undermining a sitting president.

All he is accomplishing is blostering the image of murderous raping terrorists. He is a willing idiot and that's about it.

Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top

I was drinking some soda and I'm fortunate that i was able to swallow it all before I saw this surreal title...

Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top
What strides were ever made in Iraq before the war? Hussein took Kuwait.. did talks free Kuwait from Hussein's rapists and thugs? NO. What did 12 years of "diplomacy" do after the ceasefire was signed? It made Hussein and a few UN officials a lot richer.
End of quote


Granted, but that is Iraq, not Palestine. I would much rather try to talk to them before any other option, say for example, invading.

Besides, Bush never tried, he never truly tried. Frankly, He didn't do a lot beforehand.


Carter has NO authority to speak for the nation. He has no right to play wannnabe diplomat while undermining a sitting president.
End of quote


How do you KNOW he is speaking for the US? From what I have read, he's talking to them, period. Just talking, seeing if there is anything that can be done. You'd be amazed what the right person can do while man others have failed at the same thing.


Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top
Dude, you assumed and are an ass because of it. Did I say anything about wanting only effort?Dude! Show me where I said you wanted only effort? Do not make an ass of yourself. I made a generalized statement, and will hold to it. Your post affirms the stereotype.Liberals are all about intents, not results. You seem to think it is good that Carter is trying, even if the results are worse than before. That is "intentions" not results.Learn to read. And stop being an Ass.
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Dude, what did I tell you about ASSumptions? You whine and bitch and moan when you are assumed to be nothing more than a republican crony, or stereotyped or labeled as a "right wing loony," correct? So quit being a fucking hypocrite, either deal with the assumptions, or stop. It's pretty simple, even a five year old could do it.

How can the results be worse if the result is continued murder and terrorism, as was the same beforehand? Also, what does it matter the results, if we're just going to "fight them" as you say. You don't go out to make your image pristine when fighting some one, you fight them.

Also, Doc, quit with the ducking and dodging. I've called you out on a few things, and you just turn it around and try to pin me, answer the fucking questions, I've done it for you.