I agree with you completely hashonboat. People have feelings about their work. And you deserve an explanation. But, I doubt if you will get one. "Elite" , "hiding in the shadows playing games", "maliciousness", I just love your choice of words. But, with the way you correctly spelled everything, I doubt if you'll get a response since they can't slam you for your spelling errors and make fun of you. I really dislike the way artists are treated here and its the reason I removed all my stuff like other artists. They will probably make fun of us both now. But, I'm on your side.

ChasUGC and hashonboat-I strongly agree with both of you and ChasUGC like yourself what little work I had here I moved. For whatever reasons the site seems to take pride in running off artists. Don"t know if you guys seen the thread were there is serious discussion to remove the wallpaper section but wouldn"t that be like McDonalds decideing not to use buns?

This isn't worth responding to... other than to say I'm really tired of being insulted by crybabies. There's nothing i could say here that wouldn't sound pretty foul. I will point out to you though, the only people quilty of what you claim is happening here is you. You're spewing poison and the good people here deserve better.

oh...oh woe, woe is me, I shall prove to the world how much I loved her by slicing off my ear. That will teach her

If we do away with moderation, make all uploads auto-rated 10, and have the moderators shot,............... will you be happy then?  

hashonboat, if you looked real close, you have a rating of 3 and only 1 rating, that means thats what it was moderated at. So the A-hole is a moderator. It's not something I would download. Kind of think you were lucky it made it.

Guess that same person is rating all the latest walls low too, WOM

You might be right pictoratus. I looked at the first 10 and they seemed to be rated a little high. But thats my opinion.

From the amount of downloads (or lack of I should say), your opinion might be shared among a few others
[Message Edited]

hashonboat....I assume you're referring to the 'My Computer' logon.....it has one rating, a '3', by the moderator who 'approved' it....if you wish I can critique it for you....give good reason why I consider the '3' quite generous...but it may be better [for you] handled privately...

LET THE COMMUNITY DECIDE WHAT THE RATING SHOULD BE. If it passes moderation leave it alone. That will solve all the rating confusion. Or are the Admins and moderators enjoying their power to squash creativity by putting their own ratings on everything. And, don't tell me politics doesn't play a part in this. Politics, meaning how popular the artist is. How you feel about the work based on your own artistic prowess. Or just, how you feel about it personally. That is all politics.

And you, ChasUGC are a superior being, capable of bias-free apolitical, independent and objective valuation....because you are NOT a moderator......what a load of unmitigated crap.

Politics is not an issue....you still have a voice here, do you not?

Maybe even have the ratings incorporated into the comments. That way a artist can see who gave them their rating. If cruel people in the community want to go around giving bad ratings then maybe the person will at least know who did it. And if the person has a email address listed they can ask why personally. This way the artist can hopefully get constructive feedback.

Chas...no...then you end up with on-site, and off-site flame wars.

The way the situation is now, if an artist is concerned about a rating or a comment he need only contact an admin with those concerns for it to be looked into...appropriately, and with authority....serial abusers of the ratings and/or comments would have their access revoked or limited....

Maybe even have the ratings incorporated into the comments.

Chances are that you don't like my comments when I rate you a 4. I would have to hurt your feelings.

That way a artist can see who gave them their rating.

Admins that reject a wall do not send rejections e-mails because of personal attacks. So, when I rate you a 4 then I am in for the same treatment as the admins get. No thanks.

If cruel people in the community want to go around giving bad ratings then maybe the person will at least know who did it.

How about the cruel skinners that attack moderators?

And if the person has a email address listed they can ask why personally.

Oh no!

This site is stuck on moderation and the need to rate submissions..................if you remove moderation you can allow people the option to rate the wall, or logon, or whatever else and leave it at that. I'm tired of everyone dancing around the issue on this. As you can see many people are pulling their work from your site. Something needs to be done before you loose your comtributing base of members. If you are worried about the shear number of submissions which will either look sub par, low-grade, or like a newbie made it then that may be the trade off. I'm primarily talking of the wallpaper library.

You will not satisfy anyone by having the walls moderated sharply or being more leniantly (spell check). I'm starting to sound like a broken record but I'll say it again..........humans are competitive by nature and when you have ratings and who ranked number one for the day, people will strive for that and along the way peoples feelings will get hurt, accusations will be thrown all over the place or the sense of not being treated equally.

One more thing, I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels this way (others have told me already anyway), but it seems that the "pepole" in charge here come off as arrogant and when someone comments negatively about things they are bashed. Not a good way of handling complaints or the like by making someone feel stupid.....and NO, I won't accept your reason if it's "They deserved it" or "They were asking for it". This place is starting to suck!

Green Armani: There is a small amount of people that bring the issues up you mention. That group is very well known and will not accept any answer or reason. If something sucks then that is it.

There are only a few people who have taken it upon themselves to depart....most are wallpaper artists, not skinners....and some of those have been catered for ad nauseum only to have them leave.....really says a lot for appreciating efforts, their true colours, and whether a person will actually be 'missed' as a valid contributor or just a pain in the butt.

Talk to those who have been particularly acerbic in their condemnation of all and sundry and ask them whether or not they were genuinely treated with a lot of patience and mature discussion.

Moderation and or ratings are here to stay in one form or another....if you, if anyone cannot stomach them then perhaps another site is for you, assuming you find one without some form of restriction of upload or standard of rating.

If you cannot find one, feel free to create one.

The horrible reality is that Wincustomize.com is, in spite of moderation and ratings, a quite successful and popular site.  Clearly something is actually being done 'right'.

What frustrates is the apparent belief that although a site is not 'good enough' to host a person's work, he believes the site is obliged to change its functioning to accomodate him.

Is this arrogance or is it not?

I won't name names but some of those departed really annoy me.....why should we waste our time on ingrates when there are others more deserving/appreciative of help/response?

Some return after restoration of reason, restoring their library and continue to be valued members of the community....others just desire to be a noise to be reckoned with.

This message board is only a tiny part of Wincustomize....and its loudest voices are trying to monopolise the Admins'/Moderators' time inequitably, claiming the sky is falling due to 'Conspiracies R Us' or some such.

The will of the many does not always get altered by the voices of the few.....perhaps only if the voice is of reason, intelligence and common sense...

My reason for mentioning this is more of an outside looking in. I was a contributor of this site and I could not complain that I was being moderated unjustly nor that I was not getting feedback to let me know why one of my walls wasn't accepted. I simply couldn't stand the way people treated each other here. I guess for me it is better that I have an outlet where my humble work could be seen and need not worry about one person's opinion dictating that. I am not here to say that what I believe is what the majority believe because you are right in that majority of contributors are quit content with the state things are. If you feel that the state of things now is status quo then that's your poragative and nothing that anyone says will change that.....reagradless of the complaints you are getting.

I am sorry I started this thread now.

This was never intended to turn into an Admin/Moderator bashing.

My opening statement has nothing at all to do with the rating that a piece of work starts with.

Keila....don't feel guilty of anything.....you'll notice there are more than one thread on this similar topic currently....if yours wasn't here another would be in its place anyway...

Chances are that you don't like my comments when I rate you a 4. I would have to hurt your feelings.

Madlce: Why would you have to hurt their feelings? You couldn't offer some friendly advice on technique or content instead ?

hashonboat, if you looked real close, you have a rating of 3 and only 1 rating, that means thats what it was moderated at. So the A-hole is a moderator. It's not something I would download. Kind of think you were lucky it made it.

WOM: How am I supposed to know submissions are given an initial rating before they are posted ? Mental Telepathy? I've have submitted other things which were accepted> I just checked and they still don't have ratings but they are up. Did I miss that somewhere or was i just supposed to know it. You think I was lucky to get a 3 ? Why?

Not your style: Don't care! Everyone has different tastes in style as evident if you look around here.

Too simple: Duh! My omly comment was that it was my first one. You think my first one is going to be the Mona Lisa? Was your first work brilliant artistry?

Too young: I have a 13 yr old daughter. She uses this computert too. In fact her 2 favorite skins are "Rainbow" & "Toon XP" So is young supposed to be a bad thing on this site? Are you a moderator? I did a search & couldn't find any work from you, but I am a know-nothing newbie so maybe I didn't do it correctly when I clicked on the link that says " click to view author's skins".

hashonboat....I assume you're referring to the 'My Computer' logon.....it has one rating, a '3', by the moderator who 'approved' it....if you wish I can critique it for you....give good reason why I consider the '3' quite generous...but it may be better [for you] handled privately...

JAFO: Why privately? Would your comments be nasty? Not to be seen and learned from by the general public here? Do you think I'm too weak & lowly to handle some friendly advice & encouragement>

Maybe the preceding commenters have no intention of helping people improve their skills. It sounds to me that if they don't personally care for your work they deem it appropriate and necessary to negatively criticize it instead of nurturing people's talents
#1: I did a search for the preceding commenters skins to get an idea of what they consider good and could not find ANY work posted at all this year.
Maybe 'yall are out of touch. Maybe you should get down off your appointed thrones and actually do something other than critique.
#2: I don't care if you do this for free or not. You are adults and if you assume the reponsibility to take it on free of charge that is your decision. Don't cry about it.
#3: The only reason this site exists is because it has made MONEY by selling subscriptions, suites and the like. So remember that the moderators, (all the way from the volunteer up to the owner) are not some gods from on high but really servants to the customer base.

My point being: To ALL would be raters. If you don't care for someones style, remember there exist an infinite number of tastes amongst people who visit this site. If you are knowledge enough to offer advice on technique, content or whatever, please do so. There are most likely many would-be aspiring, worthwhile future authors in the wings who would welcome such advice. And lastly, If you feel yourself wanting to just criticize negatively; GET YOUR HAND OFF THE MOUSE AND GO TAKE A CHILL PILL!

'nuff said. anyone wanting to bash me for my comments (publicly or privately)go for it! You know where to find me, and my e-mail is published. I'll even give you my home phone number if you would like.


Have a nice day, I gotta go.

For heaven's sake take a darned pill. You created something and you like it. Good! Someone didn't like it as much as you think they should. Tough. >

This is really getting to be an annoying topic. At the risk of offending any number of people here, many of whom I consider friends, if you don't like the game, play elsewhere! There are things here I don't use because they don't suit me however well done. There are other things I don't use because I think they're poorly done.

There's even a couple of poorly done things I use because I made them. If anything the moderators are too easy - at least if how they rated my few offerings are any indication.

All this ratings stuff reminds me of "American Psycho" and their business cards rubbish

Ratings should not matter, if someone likes a skin then that's fine, if they don't then that's fine also