ship modders wanted for project

from Stardock Forums
Hello all
I have been thinking about doing a new series of ships but wanted to use cars,trucks,tractors,trains,semis etc.. for the models.I have messed around with mutil but am having problems getting a decent grip on how exactly this program works.If you can help much appreciation would be sent your way and hopefully some decent new ships.

I also remember reading somewhere that a new ship encoder is available but don't remember where it was.I think it was on someone elses site.I also have the ship rotator tool and this I have figured out.

Please send any info that you think might be pertinent to my endeavors.

Thanks Mike
1,990 views 24 replies
Reply #1 from Stardock Forums Top
I'll try and help out answering any questions you have, I'm in the middle of my own ship mod at the moment.

There is a ship encoder, look in the thread is titled "New Stuff For You", CariElf was kind enough to put together some docs and such. Needless to say she was right get the asprin ready....

I'd link it but I'm not sure the Html tags didn't work when I tried.

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Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top
Stydracos
Thanks for advice.
Now would you be kind enough to explain how to get those links to work?I tried several variations according to a couple other posts but all I keep getting is 404 error(page not found).
Thanks Mike
Offworld Trading Company
Reply #3 from Stardock Forums Top
Hopefully these all worked, I went through most of them.

About Gal Civ Fonts.doc
www.galciv.com/carielf/About Gal Civ Fonts.doc

Data 1.05.zip
www.galciv.com/carielf/Data 1.05.zip

Data v1-04-059.zip
www.galciv.com/carielf/Data v1-04-059.zip

Font Gfx.zip
www.galciv.com/carielf/Font Gfx.zip

M_util build.zip
www.galciv.com/carielf/M_util build.zip

Making a sample app.doc
www.galciv.com/carielf/Making a sample app.doc

MUtil.doc
www.galciv.com/carielf/MUtil.doc

ship encoder.zip
www.galciv.com/carielf/ship encoder.zip

gc_ship_encoder_040803.zip (not sure the difference)
http://storage.stardock.com/files/gc_ship_encoder_040803.zip

ship encoder + mutil.zip
No Idea, where this one is! :)
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Reply #4 from Stardock Forums Top
Thanks
I will try to find the last as that was the one that I needed the most.
IIrc there was another fan based site that the owner made his own ship encoder that was supposedely easier to work with than mutil.Might be someone like madmaz or someone else.Can't remember though.After I reformatted machine as part of upgrade I lost his link.

Any tips would be appreciated about mutil.
Thanks Mike
Reply #5 from Stardock Forums Top
Well I'm no expert, but I'll try and help :).

I see if I can sit down and write out what I've worked out. I can only draw on what I've done as I'm doing a lengthy ship mod too (which because of the tools is taking too long!). I'll post my own version of a walkthrough here in a couple of days... gives me an incentive to go back for the third time and try and fix on of my ship models.

For now I'll just babble on a bit ;). The Ship encoder is fairly easy to use once you get the process down correctly, took me a few goes to get something to show in game.. Its the friendlier tool of the two as it has very few buttons :D seriously though the problem lies in the lack of feedback.
So far it seems only a debug file is chucked out to inform you of your errors... Unfortunately for me I noticed even when it works perfectly the debug file still shows errors that must be harmless... very misleading.

Unfortunately Mutil is painful to use... in fact I sure its a tool designed for masochists.
There doesn't seem to be an export button that exports anything and as far as I can tell to edit a file requires recreating the file from scratch! I might be wrong on this but until told otherwise (with an explaination how to do it) this is what seems to be the case. I have a bigger gripe list but I'll let you makeyour own.

I tried to use the Mutil tool to create a new set of interfacing for the alignments to make it easier for people to use (each button same pic etc) but had to give up... Both tools are frustrating as theres no way to quickly fix anything as far as I can tell.

Basically I think this accounts for the lack of graphical mods, Mutil is just too unfriendly.
It needs an export for the graphics, an import for adding and replacing files etc. One of the biggest irritations for me is no ability to use copy and paste.

Wow, I've just realises I don't like these tools much LOL any how I see if I can get that thing done.
I'm still looking for that last tool too, also I'll look out for this other tool you mention as it sounds like just the thing I need.

~SDC~
Reply #6 from Stardock Forums Top
Oh and check out Dark Rain's site for an excellent ship rotator!

http://visualta.tauniverse.com/HTML/index.html



~SDC~
Reply #7 from Stardock Forums Top
You hit the nail on the head my friend.Dark Rain was the site I was trying to think of earlier.He has built a slightly easier tool to use from other forums I read a time ago.I didn't have time back then but have some free time now to try to do this mod.
There is a link somewhere on his thread about a tool he developed to write his own mods for ships.I am at work now but tonite I will scour his site til I find it.Maybe once I figure out his tools we can help each other.
The other mods are getting to easy and I wanted a challenge so from what I here a ship mod it is.
Thank you again.
I will find the other tool and give you a link later tonite.
Mike
Reply #8 from Stardock Forums Top
Ok second try to post, since Stardock central ate my first post.

Not sure if Dark Rain has finsihed that tool, may have to send him an email to say there is interest and
if he still working on it. Wanted to thank you Eradicus without realising it you have renewed my interest
in modding just as I was giving up.

Started writing some stuff up, came to realise I can't contribute much beyond a reworded version of CariElf's documentation... she did do a great job afterall. Hopefully someone may be able to understand my gibberish better then CariElf's well worded and thought out doc :).

So far I'm using it as a learning exercise, as I'm getting close to the final stages of creating 7 new ships. The big issue for me is that each ship type is represented differently for each race (49 different ship images ). This is time consuming getting it right graphically, testing and getting a good result in game. I don't want to stuff around with each ship 2-3 times like I'm doing with the one thats 'completed'.

Anyhow back to it then ;)

~SDC~
Reply #9 from Stardock Forums Top
If you would like Maybe I can help you to learn how it wprks anyway.
Sat down last nite and read thru DR site and could only find mention of upcoming tools.I also already have all documents from links listed.I thought the reformat process on my cpu wiped out those files but I found them hidden away on my d drive.The last link is a mutil/kodak viewer hybrid.I think I still have the zip and can check when I get home later and send it to you.With this one the only formats supported are jpg,tiff,bmp? and one other.So you need a conversion tool after making image in this program IIRC.
WEll back to work.
Mike
Reply #10 from Stardock Forums Top
Remembered how to use the ship encoder after writing out a first draft so I'm ok with that one.

Hmm what version number is that Mutil? So far I have version 3.3.3 .

As for help with Mutil... Well if you can figure out how to edit books in a library without redoing the entire thing from scratch I'd like to know about it. Basically I want to be able to put new images into and existing book or extract ones already there... though as far as I can tell this is impossible.

Though I really must re-read the Mutil doc, guess I overlooked its existance again.

Otherwise I'm interested in hearing more about your mod. What made you decide to use cars, trucks etc
~SDC~
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Reply #11 from Stardock Forums Top
I wass driving home from work one day and started to notice that some cars are wimpy and others more and more powerful.Well one thought led to another and I started to think in terms of all the different vehicles out there.So I thought about a possible progression like this:
star fighter=VW Beetle
battle axe=older stlye car maybe 57 chevy
battle axe= convertible(not very strong)
battle cruiser=older mercury
Battle hammer Old Continental
frigate=corvette(speed)
dreadnaught=van
freighter=semi
Advanced freighter=train
colony ship=bus
Troop transport=humvee
and so on.
I haven't really settled on a particular line up yet but have been turning it over in my brain.Maybe you could add on this list til one good list is complete from top to bottom.We could probably do different races with custom paint jobs or something similar.
The styles of cars and/or other vehicles are almost limitless.If the graphics would come out great then maybe even trying different car linees like BMW,Mercedes,Triumphs,Harley Davidsons,etc... could even work.

But first things first.I need to learn how the utilities work and monkey around til I figure out the easiest path.Once this is accomplished then work can begin on some serious interstellar cruise machines.

Also thought about the future of cars that will probably hover with wheels only touching on takeoff/landing.Like the Jetsons.
Well enough for now.
Thanks
Mike

Also the version that I just checked is called Mutilmainwindow.pcx,but when I open it, it opens Kodak image editor.The title on the window is as above.The help/about screen says its registered to Kodak as well.Maybe someone monkied with it and did a few conversions to its interface.Interesting.Maybe we need a little help from above with this one.I remember downloading several utilities one day long ago.This one was in the folder that I put all ship modding utils in.

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Reply #12 from Stardock Forums Top
I wonder if Hawaii 5 0 can make his galciv writer program use the merge files portion do what you were asking about the mdl book?
Reply #13 from Stardock Forums Top
Stydacos
On the mods page some pulled the star trek mod thread up and in it about half way down is some help about alpha channels if you use paintshop pro.
What programs are you using to do your ships?
So far I've tried paint to make the basic bmp but looks very poor.I dont have paint pro but can get it from work.
Mike
Reply #14 from Stardock Forums Top
Stydracos
Hey dude.Found another link that has some more detailed instructions about the order of precedence.IOW the order that you need to do things.CDG creations has a couple ppl that do some mods and from time to time I go there to read.Hope this one helps.
Mike
http://www.cdgroup.org/forums/tbs/gc/viewtopic.php?t=349
Reply #15 from Stardock Forums Top
Now I have this image of a Drengin VW Bettle with tiny little wings and a squashed Drengin inside suffering road rage. I like the idea, its different and will be a nice change from what I'm doing now.

3DMax is what I use to create the actual ship and Photoshop to create skins, then edit the images for use.

If you can't get a good image editor try out GIMP, its what I used before I got Photoshop otherwise use paint pro if you can get it. Just in case heres the http://www.gimp.org/~tml/gimp/win32/

Sorry for the short reply blame real life its such a distraction.

What I'm working on at the moment is my portfolio... pretty soon I'll have what I've done and my GalCiv Stuff up there so you can see what I've achieved so far.

Edited as I need more sleep!

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Reply #16 from Stardock Forums Top
Thought I'd show what my first ship looks like eradicus,

http://www.hypermax.net.au/~agooch/art/galciv/640_BattleLords.jpg



~SDC~
Reply #17 from Stardock Forums Top
That looks really good.I haven't had any time as of late.Working 7 days a week plus parents just left town.
Reply #18 from Stardock Forums Top
No problem eradicus just wanted to see if my ship stank or not.

I have to check out Mutil now to see if I can play with making the palettes the same as the games.
Funny thing is I've been saying and wanting to do that for 2 days now.

The other thing for your mod you might want to check out sites for model references to get the top views of cars you could probably use those with some editing for the ships... when I get some time I'll try and find the links to show what I mean.

~SDC~
Reply #19 from Stardock Forums Top
I want mine to use isometeric views so you can see wheels and side mounted weapons platforms.You can also tell the direction they are going but for this I will need a left and right side view.I have a program that can flip or rotate views as neccessary.
Reply #20 from Stardock Forums Top
Stydracos
Hows the project coming?I have done some checking at work with one of our programmers and found out we have several programs that can do some of the above mentioned things.I am going to talk to him some more and maybe get him to help me lay out my initial bmp's.
Today I learned that we we have a program called Carrera that is a high end graphics program.We also have paint shop pro,Adobe photoshop and the above mentioned program.I am going to get a copy of Carrera to try to do my ships in.
If you need some help let me know as I just got a new position in my company which means my travel time will be cut in half.That means I will be having some more free time in near future.
Reply #21 from Stardock Forums Top
Congrats on the new position, unfortunately I haven't progressed all that far. Time spent doing other things. I managed to get in a few GalCiv games to look at my new ship in game...

I like the way isometric view can look, saw the star trek project and am impressed what a little depth can do. Unforuntately I'm stuck with topview if its to 'fit' in with the current ships.

I'm both happy and unhappy with the results as my biggest problem is making the ships 'fit' the rest of the ship of that race. The Yor fits, Terran too, Torian is good though a bit too white.
The Arcean version is ok colour wise and probably scraps in, however the drengin version needs more detail. The altarian ship looks good but not altarian... would have been better as a minor. The minor version looks erm, has a bad paint job ;). Also noticed some versions of the ships still get a white line around them is they are on top of a large stack of ships, thought I'd already fixed that.

What I think I'll do is basically scrap what I've done and start fresh, it will save time in the long run. I'll have to sit down and take heaps of screenshots and sketch some ships in detail first.
Then model them, skin etc, whack'em in the game as decoration ships and see what they look like.

Hmmm Carrera can't find a website with screenshots. Nevermind I'll stick to Photoshop for now.

~SDC~
Reply #22 from Stardock Forums Top
Sorry about spelling.Its carrara.The link is
http://www.eovia.com/
Look at product tour and further down page click artistic rendering.Several next buttons later you will find page that does
projects very similar to what we are trying to do.
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Reply #23 from Stardock Forums Top
Here is link refering to ship capabilities.
http://www.eovia.com/community/tutorials_car.jsp
Look about half way down for spaceship tutorial.
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Reply #24 from Stardock Forums Top
This almost the kind of space freighter I would like myself as a part of my ship models.
This picture can be found at link.(npr-truck04)9 rows down
http://www.eovia.com/carrara/showcase_car.jsp
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There is a free download(trial version) that I am pulling as I type this to see if it will work.
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