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No DesktopX for me...

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No DesktopX for me...

and why I'm using Konfabulator for the time being...

from JoeUser Forums
As an ObjectDesktop subscriber since 1998, I really appreciate all of the work Stardock has done and all of the innovative software they've produced. Additionally, I love their distribution model and the value I get from their software and the great way they treat their customers. It's what makes it easy to annually update my subscription. So, as you can see, I've been following them for a long time and I shameless plug their software whenever I can.

With the recent popularity of desktop widgets/objects, I've followed the trend and added useful desktop widgets to my desktop for more functionality and some eye candy. As a OD subscriber, I've spent the last couple of years trying to use DesktopX but ultimately, I end up unloading it. I just read Brad's article of Konfabulator vs. DesktopX and found it interesting. His comparison is more or less spot on but I still find myself using Konfabulator more than DesktopX.

Here's are some of my reasons in no particular order:

1. Konfabulator is extremely easy to use. The interface is consistent and widgets work as they should.
2. The program is polished. Since it's only built to do one thing, it does that one thing well. That's a good thing.
3. Widgets tend to be extremely polished. There are two reasons. First, the program is newer so there aren't as many widgets to begin with. Second, the audience of Konfabulator do tend to be more experienced graphic designers and thus, the widgets are more polished.

I understand that DesktopX is far more extensible than Konfabulator; however, my issues are with DesktopX being purely used as a widget engine. What bugs me about the DesktopX platform:

1. Most of the widgets suck. While vast in numbers, DesktopX widgets are poor in nature. Granted, this is not the fault of DesktopX but rather of the content authors out there. Yeah, I know, I'm drinking the hater-ade but that's just how I feel. I spend a lot of time on Wincustomize looking for quality widgets and they are so hard to find. I'm not sure if I'm missing anything but I'd like to be able to sort by popularity. It might also help for Wincustomize to have a best of list voted on by the more senior skinners on the board.
2. DesktopX isn't friendly to the new user. Because it's meant to do so many things, DesktopX is more complicated than it needs to be. I know Stardock is constantly working on this and I've seen great strides in this area. However, it's still more complicated than Konfabulator for strictly using desktop widgets.

I keep seeing people talk about how Konfabulator uses more memory than DesktopX. I don't disagree but I also don't care. I would gladly give up more memory for a program that simply works better. I also have 2GB on most of my systems so that's part of the reason for my attitude.
Ultimately, I think Stardock will make DesktopX even more easy to use and the level of DesktopX Widget polish will increase as people get more used making Widgets and mimic the quality of what's being made with Konfabulator. I'm not sure if they'll ever be at the same level since they really aren't the same kind of program. Perhaps Stardock could make an even lower footprint version of DesktopX that's made for Widgets only or create some sort of standard template that all future Widgets need to adhere to. We'll see...in the mean time, Konfabulator has invaded my desktop and happily works alongside all of the other Stardock stuff I'm running (i.e. WindowFX, CursorXP, Enhanced Dialog, IconPackager, LogonStudio, Thinkdesk). Yeah, WindowBlinds is conspicuously missing but that's a story for another day.
desktopx
18,324 views 43 replies
Reply #26 from JoeUser Forums Top
Somewhat unrelated but I don't feel like starting a new post simply for this but Konfabulator 2.01 was released today and it's noticeably less memory than before. 3 widgets + the program now = ~25MB. Previously, it was ~36MB or so. So, that's a definite improvement. Yay.
Reply #27 from WinCustomize Forums Top
When are we getting simplified access to DesktopX ie getting at the Script Editor by simply opening a script file. How do I find out what the different types of file are used for? Although there are various guides they miss out important things like the above.
The Political Machine 2024
Reply #28 from WinCustomize Forums Top
If you load DesktopX and choose "load widgets" the widget manager in DesktopX is essentially identically to the widget management in Konfabulator.


Except, as far as I can tell, it doesn't save your widget setup once you exit. Fix that and I think that would be a great improvement. As it is, load Koonfabulator, select the widgets you want, place them, then exit. Start it back up and you have those same widgets loaded. I haven't been able to get the same thing to happen with the widget manager. And while I know I could use DesktopX, import the widgets and save that as a .desktop (or whatever the extension is these days), doing that loses the right click menu that is pretty important for some widgets. If the Widgetmanager.exe would simply save the placement and the widgets upon exit, and load those same widgets upon starting again (like Konfabulator or Kapsules do) it would actually be a useful application.
Reply #29 from WinCustomize Forums Top

I think alot of this boils down to DesktopX needs better widget, I am only one person, but have been using DesktopX for months now, everyday. Makeing screens for Gal Civ 2. And upon compleation of the Icon-A-Day totorials, will be starting a series on DesktopX. Not quite a Widget-A-Day. But something like it. I would love very much to get the debate away from the widget quality problem.

PS. I was not aware that Core Weather was broken in 3.0 it seems to be working for me, I will look into it ASAP.

Reply #30 from WinCustomize Forums Top
PS. I was not aware that Core Weather was broken in 3.0 it seems to be working for me, I will look into it ASAP.


Mormegil: I am not convinced it is. It was doing for me exaclty what was described above, and I was about to reply along those lines, but I first cleaned out the Theme and Widget caches in Doc & Settings/My Name/Local Settings/Application Data/Stardock/DesktopX and found that the problem entirely disappeared. I don't see it where Corky reports having done the same, so that may be the issue. There may be something more, but since I could exactly replicate the problem before cleaning the cache, and it disappeared after, that may be where Corky needs to go first.
Reply #31 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Thanks, BlueDev - I will try that.

I did try installing "DX 3" three times after clean installs of OS, and all softwares, and got the same result as soon as I double-clicked on the widget. I sent Brad a picture via e-mail to show the issue.

Perhaps clearing the cache after initial start will solve it.

If not, I can always start anew.
Reply #32 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Best of luck, hope you can get it to work as I agree that the Core widgets are simply fantastic.
Reply #33 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Someone, please, take the green smileys off the server.
Green smileys make me sick.
Reply #34 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Back again with Core weather widget report.

Installed DX3, then tried the following:

1 - I tried BlueDev's suggestion of clearing cache after starting the widget and seeing issue.
2 - tried loading widget from welcome object - same issue (also tried clearing cache).
3 - tried loading from DXBuilder - same issue (also tried clearing cache).

Results were all negative for fix.

Issue is:

Partly Cloudy condition (Livonia, MI) and Mostly Cloudy condition (Seattle, WA - where I live) displays with the first word of condition above the "City, State" text, and the second word of condition below first word (which also results in partially obstructing view of "City, State" text).

The small text of "www.weather.com" at bottom of widget reads "ww.weather.co"

When trying to click on the "City, State" text to change location, the current temperature changes from F to C, and back. Click to the side of the "City, State" text will bring up the change location dialog.

All other parts of widget seem to work fine.

Note:

At one point (a few weeks ago), I tried importing the widget, then exporting as an object > loading said object - to fix it. I had a hard time, because I had to ungroup to get to the text line I wanted to change (could not access the right-click properties due to object not recognizing the mouse position or something, and then the objects seperated - with half the objects on one side of screen while the other remained in place.

Anyway, I was able to reset the text width and height using "follow aspect ratio" option, which placed the text horizontally correct, but the widget was never quite the same after I tried to align the seperated pieces back onto the background object (I definitely need practice making object groups).

Long story short, I still have problem widget and no solution to the only series I actually used extensively.

It may just be my system, though DX 2.40.035 and Core weather worked perfectly on same system.
Reply #35 from WinCustomize Forums Top

Which is also akin to saying that DesktopX is better than Konfabulator because it's technically superior.

No, you certainly can't control how people use DesktopX or the content they make (and neither can Konfabulator) but you can certainly help/guide people to create better content. Better content means more buzz and more buzz means more DesktopX users. Heck, perhaps you could start a spin off company that solely builds high-class content using the technologies that Stardock creates. I would certainly pay money for good content...it's the same reason why I keep subscribing to ODNT, the content is good and worth it.

That's what we are doing: http://www.desktopgadgets.com launches in about a month. 

But to use an analogy: If there are two TV sets and one is a HDTV and the other is a regular set, it's not a failing of the HDTV set if someone is tuned into a station playing say a black & white show. 

There are tons of tutorials for DesktopX.  How many are there for other programs such as konfabulator? Not nearly as many.  It's ultimately up to the community to make the content.  If we're going to make the content, we're going to make it in the form that generates revenue which is what we're moving towards.

Our perspective is that the market for widget enabling programs simply doesn't justify the kind of time needed to "educate" people on how to make free widgets.  For all the energy and excitement Dashboard/Konfabulator have gotten, a popular Konfabulator widget doesn't get anywhere near the kinds of downloads that a popular WindowBlinds skin or even a popular DesktopX theme. 

On the other hand, DesktopX-created content such as Aquarium Desktop and Natural Desktop (with several others in the works) probably generate more revenue per amount spent than all of the widget-enabling programs combined.

Reply #36 from WinCustomize Forums Top

When are we getting simplified access to DesktopX ie getting at the Script Editor by simply opening a script file. How do I find out what the different types of file are used for? Although there are various guides they miss out important things like the above.

That's not how it works.  The script is part of the object.  You would right click on the object and edit it's script. You don't just edit scripts on the disk drive:

I'm not sure how much easier than this it can get.  You can create an entire script for a very complex widget/desktop/whatever from a single location.

Reply #37 from WinCustomize Forums Top

Except, as far as I can tell, it doesn't save your widget setup once you exit. Fix that and I think that would be a great improvement. As it is, load Koonfabulator, select the widgets you want, place them, then exit. Start it back up and you have those same widgets loaded. I haven't been able to get the same thing to happen with the widget manager. And while I know I could use DesktopX, import the widgets and save that as a .desktop (or whatever the extension is these days), doing that loses the right click menu that is pretty important for some widgets. If the Widgetmanager.exe would simply save the placement and the widgets upon exit, and load those same widgets upon starting again (like Konfabulator or Kapsules do) it would actually be a useful application.

If you want to create a desktop in which everything loads exactly how you want it then you would load up DesktopX, set it to run-on-startup, and import the widgets you want onto it.

Though personally, what I do is I load up various widgets and right click on them to tell them to run on-start up at which point they are treated like regular programs.

Reply #38 from WinCustomize Forums Top
If you want to create a desktop in which everything loads exactly how you want it then you would load up DesktopX, set it to run-on-startup, and import the widgets you want onto it.


I know, that is why I said I could do that in my post.

But that ignores the inherent problem of doing that, and becomes one of the areas in which DesktopX is weaker than the competition. If I import widgets into DesktopX.exe or DesktopX Builder.exe they no longer are widgets. They are now objects. This makes them easier to modify inadvertently and you lose the widget right click menu that allows for hue shifting. And while it is nice that it runs as a single process rather than many, there are times when I don't want my widgets to run as objects, I want them to run as widgets. That is why I continue to assert that WidgetManager.exe should also save the widgets you have loaded and their position upon exit. I also am well aware that I could select the widgets I want and have then run on startup, but that doesn't solve the problem of what to do when I want to shut my widgets off (when I am playing a resource intense game or such). Then I end up having to manually start those widgets up when I am done and again, DesktopX comes up short in that aspect. I want to be able to run one program (in this case WidgetManager.exe) and have all my selected widgets (NOT objects, an important distinction) show up. And I doubt I am the only one who would like that.
Reply #39 from WinCustomize Forums Top
BlueDev - I see what you're saying.  I imagine it wouldn't be that hard to have WidgetManager have a setting for keeping track of all the widgets currently running and such.
Reply #40 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I imagine it wouldn't be that hard to have WidgetManager have a setting for keeping track of all the widgets currently running and such.


I really would love to see that, and that would be, for me, the kicker that pushed DesktopX into the 'every day' use category.
Reply #41 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Just bear in mind, right now, you can right click on any widget and have it come back on start-up.  The idea was to give users the ability to choose which widgets they want to "come back" versus ones they just want to bring up for that session.
Reply #42 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I haven't tried Konfabulator or given DX3 a tryout yet, though I tried hard but in vain to use DX1 & DX2. The other SD apps I routinely use (and love) - WB, WFX, IP, OB(1.65) - never get in the way. With DX, I was always having to deal with "How do I do that?" or "How the H did that happen?" and it seemed like I never got past the desktop to get anything done.

My experience exactly
Part of my reluctance to jump back in, I suppose, is that I have less of a burning desire to have a cool-looking weather widget on my desktop (it's always hot & clear here), seldom even see my desktop...

That's really it for me. I would take the time and figure it out, but I hardly ever see my desktop. I'm too busy trying to get stuff done. Now ObjectBar!!! That's the tool! Let me put all my cool stuff on it and slide it outta the way when I'm working on an app. Slide my mouse to the left side of the descktop and OB just slides into view with all my stuff there. OB2 promises to be even better

Ace
Reply #43 from WinCustomize Forums Top
In my humble opinion; Being one who modifies and creates widgets/objects, The only way to be able to realy understand something is to do it. You can't learn scripting if you do not look at others scripts. I think the same applies to widgets wether they be from one company or the next. As I say sometimes: Form = Function
besides, DesktopX is a program focused on 'Themes' not objects. If they wanted to do nothing but widgets they would not be where they are today. comparing DTX to a widget program is like comparing Microsoft to Netscape.
I would like to make a suggestion to our Admin; Can you guys find a way to gather the users opinions about the functionality of DTX, and use that to help develope the next version? I think by getting imput from those that use it everyday you would be able to find parts that could be adjusted or 'tweeked' for better function.