Vasari is underpowered!?

You are an idiot! And I agree with everything you said!

The Vasari seem way underpowered...



I was thinking the same thing also...

I agree that the phase gate should be dropped a level, but trust me it is QUITE clear that the vasari are MASSIVELY supperior in the hands of an experience player, let me just give you one hint

TURN
YOUR SOLAR SYSTEM
INTO A FUCKING MAZE
OF PHASEGATES

it allows you to outmanuver your enemy to the point where you can defend by bringing your ENTIRE force to bear. simply put as soon as the vasari hit civ 9 they are neigh undefeatable in battle, as they can easily counter a huge force by bringing in any extra forces from all extremities in a matter of seconds. you may lose a bit at first, but game over if you can handle building at the rate of the TEC.

I love them   

Exactly. The vasari have been hunted for a long time, and they are on the constant move so they should use large cost, low number strategy.

Doing that would make the vasari and the tec alot more different.

guys the main TEC strategy is multi's favorite, the steamroller

the vasari strategy is unique, they are the 30 mile wide under-los-angeles anthill that can strike and kill at any time, but would never survive a straight head on battle.

you need a unique mindset for the two, think differently, survive, win.

Phase gate + TEC ship = no phase gate.
So to me that idea wont hold up unless you protect each and single one of them.

its hard to strike anywhere, when you are fighting the enemy via 2 phase lanes, and he's fortified both on his end...

no no it isnt! not unless you stick them WAY out front and neglect to give them repair station cover...

just jump your fleet around protecting them!

duh the capital-scout ship has a certain level 6 ability that can get you straight into their damn homeworld if you want (and you can hit it from pretty much any angle if you expand correctly) not to mention its got some good survivability (immunity) AND its fast AND can bypass phaseblockers

seriously guys, flip that switch in your head and its that simple.

guys the vasari are way op, far as I've seen. for godssake they can summon forces to them without buying them (absolute counter to TEC's 15) AND they can see ANYWHERE in the goddamn MAP (hyperspacing) without even having any scouting there whatsoever, talk about a great way to plan strikes...


the vasari are like an infestation, think of them that way and your set.

so using all the time to warp around protecting them aint gonna help you if you meet a TEC fleet. And you cant build a repair station near it unless you own the area.


huh what?

So the conclusion is they are both underpowered and overpowered and they play the same as the TEC and they don't play the same as the TEC.

*oh my brain hurts* - good thing we haven't thrown Advent into the mix yet or it would explode!

Just build a phase gate at all of your planets, that way you can use every last ship you have in every defensive battle.



The Antorak Marauder can create a temporary phase gate wherever it is. Combine that with phase inhibition immunity, and the Vasari player can warp his whole fleet straight to your homeworld.

a complete guide to the Vasari striking power:

The Antorak:

Class: Capital ship // Uber scout ship

Abilities:
lvl 1s:
Distort Gravity: Equivalent to a super power boost, use to escape incoming enemies or anything on your tail. useful for "dash in, dash out" type missions, ala scouting missions

Espionage: A bigger, better kickass version of scoutpod. dont bother spending on till you're level 8

Phase out Hull: Almost complete immunity, can be spammed, you're only really vulnerable to attack when you're phasespacing in these things, so dont be affraid to use this baby! (although you shouldnt use it if you want to conserve antimatter, which for extended missions deep beyond enemy lines it is a VERY good idea)

Phase Gate: Attatches you to the infamous Vasari space gate node, allows you to pull in all of your forces to one spot instantaneously, use wisely however, as if you dont bring a second level 6 Antorak in you're gonna be stuck for a while, unless you can cap the enemy planet and get a permanent phasegate up.

way to use the Antorak: dont attack from an angle that a human player will easily notice, dont go around attacking things, be inconspicuous as possible. if you're facing vasari go someplace where you're relatively certain they do not have a phasegate at, preferably a buffer zone of 2-3 planets, if thats impossible then why are you bothering with this ship...
against TEC: if you think you can puncture to the homeworld, do it, own his ass, take his planet JUST to make fun of him (oh, come in at an angle that wont put you face to face with his defenses) and then build a phasegate and get the fuck outta there.


this complete and comprehensive guide brought to you by your Schod: Schod.

bullshit, if you're vasari you shouldnt be meeting a TEC fleet in their territory, if you're on defense then you should easily be able to overwhelm them with minimal effort.

the Antorak (Schod post 12)

Antorak guide, Schod, published Ironclad games, November 02 2007

Reply #12
Reply #13
id like to see this tactic in use where you win

The Multi corporation is awaiting a replay

aw, poor multi no know how to use her own favorite army? suck it.

all your posts bely a very confrontational attitude, the vasari are NOT confrontational on offense (they are EXTREMELY confrontational on defense, but there they have an undeniably huge advantage) on offense you go sneaky, quiet and with a huge bang.

but if what you say is so good, you should easley be able to win over the TEC, else your all talk

It is rather diffucult/boring to get to Phase gate tech in a 1 on 1 game for example.

Besides, in a theoretical game: The Vesari are able to keep up and finally build phase gates. The TEC attacks with everything they have in one well and the Vesari get everything they have in the same well via phase gates. According to your logic the Vesari will then still loose as they can't win on even terms.



You still have to get the ship to lvl 6. This harasser capitol seems to be an awfully bad cap to start with so you have to level this thing the hard way (after buying initial levels). Ok, if you have it its quite powerful. But if you lose it you can't just buy a new one and do the same phase gate trick again.

multi you're the one who came whining in the first few hours of playing the game. I concede only in that the vaz need to have the phasegate brought down a technological knotch or two, you're the one who's all talk right now. talk of how the vasari suck, when you simply dont understand how to play as them.

a little hint, you, have you any brains, would know they were coming and would have struck them from a HUNDRED angles by the time they get to you, of which you would have layered yourself with tons of defenses AND jump your fleet in to help wipe up

the point is the vasari have a distinct weakness in 1 on 1 battle and production, which sounds like death, however their MASSIVELY supperior mobility and knowledge (highly tuned sensors are god) put them at a massive advantage. the TEC duffus would have to be an idiot to compile all his forces into one fleet on offense, he needs defense if he wants to protect his invaluable infrastructure.

valid point, you wouldnt want it to be too easy would you?

but either way the vasari need to get to civ 9 to start using that advantage anyhow, so it shouldnt be a concern if you actually try.

again you guys need to understand the nuances of the two, TEC has NO nuances, they are meant to roll over enemies, the vaz are death by one thousand fast cuts, and can make a damn unbeatable shield of units when nescessary, two prong attacks be damned.

I'm not saying they're flawless, in fact I doubt I'm gonna use them in mp unless its on a large map (definately not 1v1) because they suck at low tech levels and on small maps. I doubt I might use them at all considering that it would take a while to get to that tech level, however if you breach a technological stronghold you're golden.

Then let me see how you play them, i would love to see it in action as you say. Then ill accept them as they are, else there is a valid point to what im saying.


no need to be rude

Whoa don't get philosophical. The TEC enemy is no helpless puppy unless its an AI. On even terms (regarding skill) the enemy will know what you want to do with the Vesari and he will just try to steamroll you all the way you are trying to get phase gates.



This game has only three races. Barring one from competetive 1 on 1 play sounds like an underpowered race to me. It also sounds like serious "unfun" of the 1 on 1 part. Countless mirrors or TEC vs Advent would be definately not as interesting as three balanced, destinctive races.

Exactly. On the 2 player map "Close Encounter" the TEC has a huge advantage as of now.


Well heres a thought ive had since i got to know Sins of a Solar Empire
I know things aint always as you imagined it, but i know a few of us had this image of when someone would see a Vasari ship, the enemy (maybe TEC) would think, dang better be careful. As he would know he cant take it head on. So he would either wait until he get a larger force so he would know he would win.
As the Vasari cant build more then a few units because of the insane costs, they would have think hard about where put there ships, as they dont have alot and would make them weak splitting them up if the TEC should show up.

Thats how i saw it

reread the context, its not a rude comment.

and the Vasari aren't helpless kitties in the early techs, although they're close

the TEC though is definately a bear with dentures against a well gate-fortified vasari.

take the complaint to the devs, not me.

sadly you didnt see it correctly, so you're bringing an outdated viewpoint to a completely different game

the vasari are not a placement race, that would be the lumbering, slow TEC. no the vasari have insane costs NOT because their ships are powerful (they really arent) they're costly because when coupled with (the relatively cheap) phasegates they can be in a bunch of places at once.

The Lore makes it sound otherwise, with the 10.000 years as the TEC has been at peace, and as the Vasari arrives they have to arm them selfs for the first time in 10.000 years and they are able to beat an ancient race on "equal" terms, that doesnt add up anywhere.
Even with the Vasari Phase space technology they still seem far from being any real threat to the TEC

It would be sorta like us fighting our self in 10.000 years, yeah who would win!?



actually the Capital ships cost the same as TEC, just the Vasari frigats cost more in cash/resources and fleet points.

I personally think that most people aren't looking at pure mathimatical figures, the Vasari ships are on par with most TEC ships, except for the battleships the Vasari beat the TEC in almost everything.