[UTTER CHEESE] Last Stand is ridiculous on Fortress mode

I'd imagine he must have purchased a bunch of graveyard upgrades at the citadel to respawn faster.  This does bring up a very serious issue.  Aside from trying to intercept him some distance from the citadel, I don't see a good way to stop this in a 2v2.

Building hit point upgrades are actually a very good investment, since towers cannot be replaced.  Having a mostly intact tower line in the late game can be extremely rewarding, and I have come to agree with others that one player must purchase the first level of building hit points when the game begins.

Like I've said in my balance thread ( http://forums.demigodthegame.com/348135 ), his damage needs halved or something while in Last Stand.

Not only is it ridiuclous in fortress, but suicide 2-3 runs on the citadel will kill it.

Maybe he shouldn't be able to target buildings while in last stand mode

I totally agree with this.

Well to be fair... although Oak may excel at Fortress because of this, UB has a clear, dare I say it.... OP advantage in Domination. It works like this. Pick any character you want. Play Domination and verse all UB players. Now, watch as the UBs get to the flag before you do, creep before you do, and when you do fight them.... He'll kill you. No one is as effective in early game as UB simply because of spit. Since you are deprived of exp, the characters that can kick Ubs ass mid-late game, simply can't because Ub controls map. Harass, harass, harass.... and stay near flags. Boom. Insta win.

whoa, you can use universal gadget on buildings?

Is it possible to stun Oak whilst in Last Stand?

Good idea.  This gets my vote. 

I don't think reducing his overall Last Stand damage is the best solution at all.

Reducing overall damage of last stand would be just plain stupid, as it is it's only purpose.

i hardly ever use Last Stand, since dying is still dying, but this does seem to be a fairly creative way to abuse it. i think the main focus of Last Stand is getting revenge on the DG that killed you, so its entirely reasonable to me to somehow hinder its effectiveness against buildings. 

for the current state of things though, i think its simple enough to just buy some building health upgrades. i prioritize these upgrades quite a bit in Fortress mode anyway. i'm really surprised the OP had neglected them. even in normal games i always buy the first one just because buildings won't regen any health without it. in Fortress, where keeping buildings alive is actually the object of the game i usually end up buying the first three building health upgrades. 

Agreed transitive. Regardless of game type. The first upgrade needs to be bought. In fortress, they are mandatory. In that mode the fortresses can be viewed as your health. Dont you want your health to regen?

Honestly. Complain more.

UB- can spit on buildings and run throughout the game. Little to no damage done to him.

Erebus- Can send minions in and chip away at the enemy's fortresses.

QoT- (see Erebus)

Regulus- Chip away using his distance. No damage taken.

Sedna- (See Erebus)

Rook- Yeah... Feeding off buildlings... Best person out there to destroy them.

The thing about Oak's minions are that they have very low health compaired to the other Generals. They are mostly there to buff Oak's damage output from Soul Power. Oak has virtually no options against buildings unless he gets in there and takes lots of damage. Which makes him an easy target for when he does want to push on people's base.

Also, if you can't push better than a single suiciding player and all the money he's giving you. Something is wrong.

I bought the first level.  Don't the rest of them just give like +5 regen and +300 HP or something?  They were utterly useless in beta, but maybe I missed a buff.

About the other demigods: the thing is, I can actually defend against them by, y'know, hunting them down and killing them, setting up observer wards and intercepting them before they reach the fortress, or scaring them away while the fortress regenerates.  Oak can just ignore me and still wipe out my fortresses.  This guy wasn't even doing it as well as he could have: he should have shielded himself on the way in to make sure he got there and did maximal damage before dying.  I also don't think he had as many points in Shield as his level allowed -- that would make this even more effective.

The problem was, we had to push the traditional way, where you don't, you know, die.  That means we had to take out all the towers in front of and around the fortress first, and deal with defending demigods.  He just ignored everything.  I will admit that we had let some of our front defenses go, because we had trouble early on and because I didn't anticipate this strategy -- when it was 2 fortresses to 2, we were dominating the map to the point that we could defend fortresses easily, until he got Last Stand.  I don't think it would have mattered.  He would have ignored them the same way he ignored us when we jumped him on his way out of his base.  (and if he'd been smarter, he would have approached the fortress with his shield up)

Anyway, I'll see if this happens next time I'm up against Oak, or if I was just dumb.  I guess the smart money is on the second option there.

Probably the best counter is to buy lots of structure health (except I still think that's useless...I'll have to look at the stats in-game), and to just concentrate on knocking down his fortresses.  I think our biggest mistake was that we tried to defend; once your opponent does this you have no choice but to attack as fast as possible.

Its all about the extra regen. If during the time Oak is dead and or travelling, your fotress can regen more health, it will take longer before it dies. Its even possible to get it up high enough, and kill Oak early enough that all his damage is healed by the next time he gets there.

In practice youll probably never get it to regen that much, but if its allows your fotresses to last 3 minutes longer each, well, if thats all the time you need to destroy theirs, its well worth the upgrades..

Pick QoT and go Uproot.. the enemy fortress are gone/almost gone before he even get's last stand.

What's the issue? lol.

lambdaman,

fortress upgrades beyond the first continue to add health on a percentage basis. each upgrade provides a further +10% to max health. regeneration rate is also boosted by a large amount, though you may be correct that its a constant rate. regardless, the scaling on it is not small but is large. with 3 upgrades to building health i was able to see my fortresses have 18500 health and regenerate about 3000 health in a minute. 

ran into this today, completely killed my desire to play the game. 

It sure is!

I also think spit shouldn't be able to target buildings. So If Oak gets nerfed, I saw we nerf Ub too!

would it have killed your TB ally to put some points into frost nova and just defend the fortress?

Stun him, distract him, slow him down, whatever. I agree this should be looked into however, but I don't think the solution is to nerf Last Stand, since it works as intended.

 However, if we are going to talk about this, which only happens on one game mode, we should also be talking about Erebus curcible map exploit. Both are similar in that they are only effective on one mode/map.

Would pushing their base work, instead of engaging him, let him go his way and try to DPS race them to citadel kill, then when he dies you'll be at his citadel ready to gank him again.  Also him suicide running, will generate you mad cash on assist kills, so you'd be the first to get minions, which will in turn help you push their citadel. It is utter BS though, any plan of action should have a counter, but in this case he can kill himself and not be countered in any ways directly.

I'm not sure if it's possible to stun Oak in last stand... when I hit him with a stun while shielded (as UB) I heal and keep doing the attack animation, but he continues to hit me (although that may have been shield level 4).

I know that Boulder Roll works to stun him during last stand.